Key to success on managed private land...

[dan]

The key in having a small property work is to have the best food, the best bedding, and the least pressure.

So, those of you that have private land, think about that for a minute... Do you have food sources for your deer year round?

Do you have food that is better, or is different than the neighbors?

Is there anything you can do to make the bedding better on your property? You can only have as many bucks on your property as you have places for them to bed...

And most importantly, do you put more or less pressure on your land than the neighbors?

[BackWoodsHunter]

The key in having a small property work is to have the best food, the best bedding, and the least pressure.

So, those of you that have private land, think about that for a minute... Do you have food sources for your deer year round?

Do you have food that is better, or is different than the neighbors?

Is there anything you can do to make the bedding better on your property? You can only have as many bucks on your property as you have places for them to bed...

And most importantly, do you put more or less pressure on your land than the neighbors?

I agree to the key being food and pressure. I guess where you are located but I think come late in the season the better the food the more places the deer will find to bed on your land. At least that is what I am seeing. Also, if you have less pressure than the neighbors your former mediocre spots are suddenly good spots to bed. There seems to be no great way to manage a small property and keep deer there while reaping the benefits of your hard work through use. Location is key too. In northern WI we can place a small bait pile and the deer will know we are sitting right over it but come in anyways because they need to eat.

What would you recommend to improve "buck bedding" spots? I like a lot of the hinge cutting techniques I have read about on other sites but haven't used them for any success as of yet.

[Bucky]

Access is critical too... depending on where the deer are bedding. The properties I focus on have all the above stated... water, food, and bedding cover. The pressure is sometimes not controllable unless you own land, which I do not. The tighter the three above state ingredients the better chance you have of a mature deer being killable at that location.

[dan]

I agree to the key being food and pressure. I guess where you are located but I think come late in the season the better the food the more places the deer will find to bed on your land. At least that is what I am seeing. Also, if you have less pressure than the neighbors your former mediocre spots are suddenly good spots to bed.

Are you hunting "deer" or mature bucks? Cause from what I see mature bucks will choose secure bedding over mediocre near food most of the time. And even if you can get him to bed on your "mediocre" spots in late season, he is going to get shot by the neighbors before he gets to grow up if he lives over there... I would think to have the "best" property, one would need to keep the bucks on there property most of the time, at least during daylight hours when they are killable.

What would you recommend to improve "buck bedding" spots? I like a lot of the hinge cutting techniques I have read about on other sites but haven't used them for any success as of yet.

Planting, cutting, hinging, etc.

[dan]

There seems to be no great way to manage a small property and keep deer there while reaping the benefits of your hard work through use.

I dissagree... I enjoy hunting Daves farm (80 acres ) a lot more now that we hunt it a lot less... It was not enjoyable when he hunted it ever day and did deer drives. Far more enjoyable use of the land when more bucks are seen per sit, and larger bucks... Just cause I limit my hunting there, does not mean I limit my hunting. There is plenty of public land and other places for me to hunt.

[dan]

Access is critical too... depending on where the deer are bedding. The properties I focus on have all the above stated... water, food, and bedding cover. The pressure is sometimes not controllable unless you own land, which I do not. The tighter the three above state ingredients the better chance you have of a mature deer being killable at that location.

Good points... I was once granted permission to hunt a great spot in Buffalo county by an old forum member that has since passed away. It was full of big bucks but the access I was allowed made it real tough to kill anything.

I also noticed you mentioned water, and that too is critical, and something I neglected.

[Spysar]

Where I live in NY, you can manage all you want. It aint gonna do no good. You would have to own or control a lot of land for it to work...I'm not really into managing for deer, I like to take what the land produces on its own.

[Bucky]

Where I live in NY, you can manage all you want. It aint gonna do no good. You would have to own or control a lot of land for it to work...I'm not really into managing for deer, I like to take what the land produces on its own.

I agree, it definitely takes acreage... If your neighbors are not on board, ur fighting a loosing battle

[ Post made via iPad ]

[dan]

I agree, it definitely takes acreage... If your neighbors are not on board, ur fighting a loosing battle

I dissagree... It sure is a lot easier to manage when your neigbors are on board, but you can still do it on small acerage if you work at it...

[gjs4]

Wow here is a topic I have been living since 99

Like Spystar I am in NY- whcih appears to be a totally different ball game than Wisconsin. Similar to Michigan I guess.

Here- Pressure is the biggee. Entry/exit less presence...unmolested travel or better yet unknown hunter pressence.

I disgaree that the best of everything is needed......balance is needed but pressure (and again that may be a ny thing)
pressure trumps all. That is true of deer and mature bucks.

If there is agriculture in the area- bedding is next in line...or maybe travel but that goes back to pressure.

IE- our family "farm" has some woods, some swamp, no plots for the past two yrs, with the 80% remaining being 35-40% dogwood and feral grass fields. After the first frost we own a whole of brown cover. We have had a 4.5 or older on our ground every summer and see a few (though not sure they "LIVE" there) during the oct-mid dec hunting seasons. When the pumpkins (for our 5-6wk long gun season) show our ground is a vortex for them. They feed nocturnally but sleep on our farm adn at times can be seen. The more driving and shooting the neighbors do the less we see them despite being wind/intrusion smart.

So- we built bedding. I did the Lapratt camp and feel it was money very well spent. Made various sectors or micro habitats. Most of which of still works even though the food went from 13.5ac (ideally placed) to zip. Next yr I will have food again. for sure- they move a lot more often when (even if they ran there fleeing gun fire) they hear virtually no shooting and dont even smell us.

The key to keeping managing for mature bucks is to give them everything they need. It is manipulating your land for what it is worth. teh more effort the mroe success. Not all land is created equal though. IE my buddy shot a 173 and a 160 here this year. That is unheard of in this state- despite hunter density being some of the highest in the nation i would guess that a legit NY hunter bagging 300" of antler has only happened a few times (if that). 120 highly managed acres. We set it up and worked it hard. Both bucks came from the neighboring swamp of natural movement- the booner worked the ground as designed the other was just randomly cutting through the ground. Neither appeared to be other hunter of rut related behavior. That swmap (which is not his) is refuge and thats the key. My ground has almost the entire interior being a sanctuary. I lose 50-60% of my ground when it snows because that grass folds flat. The dogwood is great cover and browse.

I could ramble on this for days....have the books and more valuable is jammed notebooks and sketches. If i have a devoid areas i know where i need to work. If i have a pile of does or jouvies and see no mature buck beds i know i am missing something. Sub habitats, observation stands, deisgned travel (cut paths, rub lines, edges) smart presence and attempts at controlling perimeter travel.... the nighbors drive, use quads, use scents during archery rely on nature bedding (though bomb through it)..what gives them juvenile bucks to shoot at is owning food...and if they see a "good one" it almost always comes from ours. BTW- I never see anything when talking to them and know absolutley zip about how to hunt

[gjs4]

Lapratt said all groudn should fall into one of these categories:

food, bedding, social, stand, or money making. If not- its wasted.

[BackWoodsHunter]

I agree to the key being food and pressure. I guess where you are located but I think come late in the season the better the food the more places the deer will find to bed on your land. At least that is what I am seeing. Also, if you have less pressure than the neighbors your former mediocre spots are suddenly good spots to bed.

Are you hunting "deer" or mature bucks? Cause from what I see mature bucks will choose secure bedding over mediocre near food most of the time. And even if you can get him to bed on your "mediocre" spots in late season, he is going to get shot by the neighbors before he gets to grow up if he lives over there... I would think to have the "best" property, one would need to keep the bucks on there property most of the time, at least during daylight hours when they are killable.

What would you recommend to improve "buck bedding" spots? I like a lot of the hinge cutting techniques I have read about on other sites but haven't used them for any success as of yet.

Planting, cutting, hinging, etc.

Your initial post stated "deer" and "bucks" I have a handful of bucks and at least 6 does using the things I am providing them in northern WI on our land which is pretty good because we don't have tons of deer per square mile. As far as mature bucks, I'm sure you could manage for them but you need more food and does IMO.

Quote:
There seems to be no great way to manage a small property and keep deer there while reaping the benefits of your hard work through use.

I dissagree... I enjoy hunting Daves farm (80 acres ) a lot more now that we hunt it a lot less... It was not enjoyable when he hunted it ever day and did deer drives. Far more enjoyable use of the land when more bucks are seen per sit, and larger bucks... Just cause I limit my hunting there, does not mean I limit my hunting. There is plenty of public land and other places for me to hunt.

If I am planting fruit trees I am also going to have to pay to maintain them with pesticides to obtain a healthy crop, not to mention I bought the trees. If I am planting crops I am spending the money on seed which is of zero return if its a plot, the gas to work the land, and time spent up there doing it. I am likely going to be buying some additional equipment or paying someone to use theirs as well. I am running my own chainsaws improving habitat which calls for fuel and repair costs. All of this is adding up. If this endeavor hits the $1000+ mark, which it easily does, the use I am I trying to enjoy is going to be on a weekly basis. It is hard to manage a small property without spending some amount of money. I want to reap the benefits of my hard work by spending time on the land. The more money/time I put into improving the land the more time I want to spend in fall with my but glued to a treestand. I didn't specify that in the first post....I have started out on minor habitat projects the past few years and already have hundreds into it between tree planting, herbicides for plots, and plot seed and tractor fuel to plant the plots.

[dan]

If I am planting fruit trees I am also going to have to pay to maintain them with pesticides to obtain a healthy crop, not to mention I bought the trees. If I am planting crops I am spending the money on seed which is of zero return if its a plot, the gas to work the land, and time spent up there doing it. I am likely going to be buying some additional equipment or paying someone to use theirs as well. I am running my own chainsaws improving habitat which calls for fuel and repair costs. All of this is adding up. If this endeavor hits the $1000+ mark, which it easily does, the use I am I trying to enjoy is going to be on a weekly basis. It is hard to manage a small property without spending some amount of money. I want to reap the benefits of my hard work by spending time on the land. The more money/time I put into improving the land the more time I want to spend in fall with my but glued to a treestand. I didn't specify that in the first post....I have started out on minor habitat projects the past few years and already have hundreds into it between tree planting, herbicides for plots, and plot seed and tractor fuel to plant the plots.

Its all a matter of what your goals are... Mine might be different. To me, 7 or 8 hunts that produce deer sighting each time out, and 2 or 3 shots at mature bucks is better time spent than 25 days on stand with one sighting of a nice buck and sightings of small deer once every 4 or 5 hunts.
To me, I could not see spending all that money on a property and then chasing all the big bucks onto the neighbors and making activity on my farm nocturnal. If sitting in a tree on land you can call your own is more important than the percentage of buck opertunitys, then go for it.

[BackWoodsHunter]

If I am planting fruit trees I am also going to have to pay to maintain them with pesticides to obtain a healthy crop, not to mention I bought the trees. If I am planting crops I am spending the money on seed which is of zero return if its a plot, the gas to work the land, and time spent up there doing it. I am likely going to be buying some additional equipment or paying someone to use theirs as well. I am running my own chainsaws improving habitat which calls for fuel and repair costs. All of this is adding up. If this endeavor hits the $1000+ mark, which it easily does, the use I am I trying to enjoy is going to be on a weekly basis. It is hard to manage a small property without spending some amount of money. I want to reap the benefits of my hard work by spending time on the land. The more money/time I put into improving the land the more time I want to spend in fall with my but glued to a treestand. I didn't specify that in the first post....I have started out on minor habitat projects the past few years and already have hundreds into it between tree planting, herbicides for plots, and plot seed and tractor fuel to plant the plots.

Its all a matter of what your goals are... Mine might be different. To me, 7 or 8 hunts that produce deer sighting each time out, and 2 or 3 shots at mature bucks is better time spent than 25 days on stand with one sighting of a nice buck and sightings of small deer once every 4 or 5 hunts.
To me, I could not see spending all that money on a property and then chasing all the big bucks onto the neighbors and making activity on my farm nocturnal. If sitting in a tree on land you can call your own is more important than the percentage of buck opertunitys, then go for it.

I hear ya but the average "land manager" has the perspective of "if I'm spending X amount of money on this land, no way in h3ll am I hunting public". I spent a lot of time on public this fall but tons more on the private we manage up north. I can only think of 2 sits I didn't see a deer and saw my target buck twice. Aside from pressure the access as stated above is key too. I am able to access on 3 sides of the land. We made a "no atv during season" rule. No quads touched the land during fall, and the only vehicle activity was by truck or mowing with the big tractor. I also got dropped off a lot and hunted the edges of the property essentially pushing deer to the center of the property. I think it worked pretty well as the mature buck I was after should have died but I was not ready when he stepped out.

[BackWoodsHunter]

How many mature bucks are you managing on the small properties you are speaking of Dan? Where I am at a 2.5yr old deer is a good deer. A guy consistently shooting deer in the 2.5yr old age class is doing things right, or so it seems. This year I was on the trail of a bigger one yet and passed up one 2.5yr old. I thought I was doing well. I cannot say how things would work/pan out if we were trying to harbor more than one deer of a truly mature age class. There is one spot on the farm where I know the big guy to hide out and things never lined up right to set up right on top of him, which I think kept him around.

I also should have added in my first post access as being most important. I have almost 500 acres of private land I have access to hunt in Fond du Lac and its broken up by roads. The access is so poor I see more deer, and better deer, in northern WI than I see there because the deer always know we are coming.