Wind based bedding...

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Ryan
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Re: Wind based bedding...

Unread postby Ryan » Sat Jul 25, 2015 3:05 am

Singing Bridge wrote:
Ryan wrote:When deer use oxbows to bed I know the general rule of thumb is that the wind would be blowing into the oxbow, but with smaller creek oxbows have you guys ever seen a buck use the water as an obstacle like a downed tree and have the wind come from the water?


Most of the time, no... but I have found several bucks bedding like you describe. There were contributing factors, however. For example, the creek was so slow it made almost no noise- if it is a noisy creek and the buck can't hear I normally do not find bedding like you describe. The other time I see bedding similar to what you are asking about is when the cover is thick enough that the buck will bed there in almost any wind direction.



Thanks for that information..in instances where the creek is pretty small and there are alot of oxbows, have you ever seen a buck just cross the creek and bed on the opposite side oxbow if the wind changes? I was going to try and experiment with it scouting this year, trying to tie deer trails from one oxbow to another on the opposite side for a opposite wind


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Re: Wind based bedding...

Unread postby Singing Bridge » Sat Jul 25, 2015 3:19 am

Ryan wrote:
Singing Bridge wrote:
Ryan wrote:When deer use oxbows to bed I know the general rule of thumb is that the wind would be blowing into the oxbow, but with smaller creek oxbows have you guys ever seen a buck use the water as an obstacle like a downed tree and have the wind come from the water?


Most of the time, no... but I have found several bucks bedding like you describe. There were contributing factors, however. For example, the creek was so slow it made almost no noise- if it is a noisy creek and the buck can't hear I normally do not find bedding like you describe. The other time I see bedding similar to what you are asking about is when the cover is thick enough that the buck will bed there in almost any wind direction.



Thanks for that information..in instances where the creek is pretty small and there are alot of oxbows, have you ever seen a buck just cross the creek and bed on the opposite side oxbow if the wind changes? I was going to try and experiment with it scouting this year, trying to tie deer trails from one oxbow to another on the opposite side for a opposite wind


Most of the small creeks I observe the buck stays put because the cover is very thick. A buck will change its bed, at times, when there is a major wind shift and he is in a vulnerable position. Also remember that his evening destination when leaving the bedding area(s) will likely remain the same irregardless of which side of the small creek he is bedding on.
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Re: Wind based bedding...

Unread postby Ryan » Sat Jul 25, 2015 3:51 am

Singing Bridge wrote: Also remember that his evening destination when leaving the bedding area(s) will likely remain the same irregardless of which side of the small creek he is bedding on.


Great point! thats the piece of the puzzle i was missing
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Re: Wind based bedding...

Unread postby dan » Sat Jul 25, 2015 4:18 am

oldrank wrote:When you find obstacle backed bedding does that usually mean a buck is using the bed? I have found a few beds in an old clear cut that are backed by a tree or kind of tunneled into the brush. Here is one I found this spring. It was well wore and actually looked like he was using both sides of the tree as you can kinda see another wore spot off to the right. Would you guys consider this a buck bed? The terrain is a sloping slightly into a small depression and is in the corner of 2 human trails that meet at a 90%.

Image


here is a diagram of how its set up.

Image


I would call that a buck bed... That does not mean that a doe won't use it though... Lone does or small groups of 2 will often use the same beds bucks use if they are unoccupied... The circular doe bedding areas we often refer to are generally doe groups of 3 or more.
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Re: Wind based bedding...

Unread postby dan » Sat Jul 25, 2015 4:20 am

Ryan wrote:When deer use oxbows to bed I know the general rule of thumb is that the wind would be blowing into the oxbow, but with smaller creek oxbows have you guys ever seen a buck use the water as an obstacle like a downed tree and have the wind come from the water?

Usually not in Oxbows, but yes, they sometimes do... The common oxbow bedding has wind blowing into the oxbow.
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Re: Wind based bedding...

Unread postby whitetailassasin » Sat Jul 25, 2015 4:35 am

Ryan wrote:When deer use oxbows to bed I know the general rule of thumb is that the wind would be blowing into the oxbow, but with smaller creek oxbows have you guys ever seen a buck use the water as an obstacle like a downed tree and have the wind come from the water?


Oxbows I'm not 100% for what your asking. But where I hunt which is primarily swamp from rivers and creeks, mature bucks will bed close to the rivers and use the pulling thermals and the river as a barrier and will bed so they can see opposite of the river. They will use the river as an escape route as well. I don't find as many buck beds in the oxbow as I do just on either side of it. On windy days, it's very easy to sneak in on these bucks and set up, but on calm days it's almost impossible to get inside that 100 yd barrier. The water and cattails almost echo. I have a couple trees I hunt that are further like 150-175 yds out and I can set up and see well into there beds. I wouldn't say they are observation stands, but I use them to hunt and also scout the nearby beds I know outside of the bed I'm hunting to see what bed is being used at that time or holding the buck I'm after.

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Re: Wind based bedding...

Unread postby rfickes87 » Mon Jan 02, 2017 10:30 am

dan wrote:This is where it gets weird... In some hill country "thermal tunnel" beds, I have seen them bed on the wrong side of the obstacle. In the picture below, the buck was bedding above the tree, and looking around it towards, the bottom "where danger would most likely come from... This is an exception, not the rule, but I have seen it more than a few times on hill sides.
Image


I love this thread. Dan do you think this bed is used simply bc the tree base offers a nice level spot to lay down? It would be a lot more comfortable to lie there than somewhere along the steel hillside?
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Re: Wind based bedding...

Unread postby dan » Mon Jan 02, 2017 10:36 am

rfickes87 wrote:
dan wrote:This is where it gets weird... In some hill country "thermal tunnel" beds, I have seen them bed on the wrong side of the obstacle. In the picture below, the buck was bedding above the tree, and looking around it towards, the bottom "where danger would most likely come from... This is an exception, not the rule, but I have seen it more than a few times on hill sides.
Image


I love this thread. Dan do you think this bed is used simply bc the tree base offers a nice level spot to lay down? It would be a lot more comfortable to lie there than somewhere along the steel hillside?

Yep... Exactly.
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Re: Wind based bedding...

Unread postby HogFan07 » Sun Mar 05, 2017 5:29 am

In hill country (without mash bottom, just ravine) at what point should you try hunting the valley/creek bottoms and not the beds up on the ridge. There have been times when it's bitter cold and the wind was only 10mph or less but no deer other times the temp is fine but it's 15-20mph winds and no deer.

Just wondering because I did kill a buck walking from his bed using a cross wind. Warm and 5-10mph wind. There was actually a second buck coming from a different point. Just wondering when they will give up these points and move to the lower points?
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Re: Wind based bedding...

Unread postby dan » Sun Mar 05, 2017 6:15 am

HogFan07 wrote:In hill country (without mash bottom, just ravine) at what point should you try hunting the valley/creek bottoms and not the beds up on the ridge. There have been times when it's bitter cold and the wind was only 10mph or less but no deer other times the temp is fine but it's 15-20mph winds and no deer.

Just wondering because I did kill a buck walking from his bed using a cross wind. Warm and 5-10mph wind. There was actually a second buck coming from a different point. Just wondering when they will give up these points and move to the lower points?

Im not understanding your question?
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Re: Wind based bedding...

Unread postby HogFan07 » Sun Mar 05, 2017 7:22 am

dan wrote:
HogFan07 wrote:In hill country (without mash bottom, just ravine) at what point should you try hunting the valley/creek bottoms and not the beds up on the ridge. There have been times when it's bitter cold and the wind was only 10mph or less but no deer other times the temp is fine but it's 15-20mph winds and no deer.

Just wondering because I did kill a buck walking from his bed using a cross wind. Warm and 5-10mph wind. There was actually a second buck coming from a different point. Just wondering when they will give up these points and move to the lower points?

Im not understanding your question?



Sorry let me try that again. What conditions/factors will make you decide to hunt the low beds instead of up beds higher up where we typically talk about the "thermal tunnel"?
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Re: Wind based bedding...

Unread postby dan » Sun Mar 05, 2017 8:33 am

HogFan07 wrote:
dan wrote:
HogFan07 wrote:In hill country (without mash bottom, just ravine) at what point should you try hunting the valley/creek bottoms and not the beds up on the ridge. There have been times when it's bitter cold and the wind was only 10mph or less but no deer other times the temp is fine but it's 15-20mph winds and no deer.

Just wondering because I did kill a buck walking from his bed using a cross wind. Warm and 5-10mph wind. There was actually a second buck coming from a different point. Just wondering when they will give up these points and move to the lower points?

Im not understanding your question?



Sorry let me try that again. What conditions/factors will make you decide to hunt the low beds instead of up beds higher up where we typically talk about the "thermal tunnel"?

I would hunt them the same as the high beds... Try to determine when there being used, both date and weather wise, and go from there... They might drop lower for several reasons like lack of cover, or the exact air currents... You might also find them bedding lower at dawn and moving higher during the day. I would need to look at the area to figure that out.
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Re: Wind based bedding...

Unread postby HogFan07 » Sun Mar 05, 2017 9:09 am

dan wrote:
HogFan07 wrote:
dan wrote:
HogFan07 wrote:In hill country (without mash bottom, just ravine) at what point should you try hunting the valley/creek bottoms and not the beds up on the ridge. There have been times when it's bitter cold and the wind was only 10mph or less but no deer other times the temp is fine but it's 15-20mph winds and no deer.

Just wondering because I did kill a buck walking from his bed using a cross wind. Warm and 5-10mph wind. There was actually a second buck coming from a different point. Just wondering when they will give up these points and move to the lower points?

Im not understanding your question?



Sorry let me try that again. What conditions/factors will make you decide to hunt the low beds instead of up beds higher up where we typically talk about the "thermal tunnel"?

I would hunt them the same as the high beds... Try to determine when there being used, both date and weather wise, and go from there... They might drop lower for several reasons like lack of cover, or the exact air currents... You might also find them bedding lower at dawn and moving higher during the day. I would need to look at the area to figure that out.


Thanks Dan, I will have to put out cameras and try and see when they are using which beds.
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Re: Wind based bedding...

Unread postby WV Bowhunter » Sun Mar 05, 2017 10:08 am

Some amazing info and bed pics in this thread. I often found beds in the past but didn't use them to my benefit enough . That's a mistake I will correct now that I found the beast. I just need to know if a big buck is using the beds I find and when. I'm not sure what the best option is for finding that information. I hunt hill country and have started putting a strip of surveyor tape above the beds, I'm hoping I can glass some of the beds from the opposite hillside and see what is using them.
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Re: Wind based bedding...

Unread postby SidewayZ » Fri Mar 10, 2017 2:21 am

dan wrote:
I saw one of your clips from an old tv show where you talk about deer quartering into the wind. I see this more often than not sometimes, they just dont care, gene wensel said "some deer just never learn to use the wind" and I believe that to be true. Probably explains a lot of the LUCK we all saw early in our hunting career. Obviously if they were masters of the wind always, we wouldnt ever kill them but comes back to how consistent are you on mature bucks. Where I live, for every 5000 deer there might be 1-3 that are 3.5 or older but even a 3.5 here would be considered mature in my eyes.

I am not sure what I said on the TV show your reffering too. But as of now, I am convinced that most of the time outside of the rut that deer travel with little regard to the wind unless they feel they are in danger. There are some exceptions to that. But I see deer leave bedding in every direction, however, when the wind is in there favor, it seems you get a little earlier movment.
The biggest trend I see with deer moving in regards to the wind (again outside of the rut ) is when approaching a bedding spot. They seem to like to approach with wind to face. They sometimes J-hook to walk around to the downwind side then move in to the bed.



Dan just to clarify, I think it was on the Traditional Bowhunter Podcast I believe you mentioned that when there is a clear trail in / out of the bedding area that the trail will certainly be the trail the buck will use to exit and that with regard to entry of the bedding area the buck could enter from any direction.

So I guess the specific question is, "If there is a hard trail from bedding" this is the main route of exit (unless danger exists)? Or will the buck exit any direction?

I will have to relisten to that as well. Maybe I am confusing Wind based and most likely Hilly terrain bedding with Marsh or Swamp bedding?
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