So lets talk about Michigan!!

[wmihunter]

I’m almost to the point with limited time due to family tha it’s not worth Hunting Michigan. I shot two 100” bucks in Michigan and have little drive to shoot another that size. I want a quality 120” plus 3 year old and my time is better spent elsewhere

[Boogieman1]

I have some unpopular Michigan questions These are all based on 2nd hand knowledge and personally never have run into a Michigan Hunter so feel free to correct me. But if there is 700,000 Michigan hunters atleast 350,000 of them have written or have a book in the works of whitetail expertise.

I always hear about how sorry genetics are and small antler justification but isn't Michigan in the top 10 B&C states every year? If the answer is that's on private then it comes down to self control on the hunters part or a culture of gotta shoot something. Cause it's the same genetics just not allowed to mature.

Hear it's a culture thing of gotta shoot something. The last thing a guy from Kansas, Illinios or Iowa wants is some Michigan hunters lol. The ones I have talked to say they are gonna shoot something no matter what. Fork horn, up and coming 2.5 year old with good potential it don't matter. What bothers them is guys come down and shoot a buck all the locals passed up and then talk about how easy it is. Again don't have and first hand experience with this so don't shoot the messenger.

Next complaint is pressure. How is pressure proven by license sales? Give an example from a county in my state. First off 99% of the state is privately owned yet. Particular county I speak of is primarily owned by 3 ranches which leases for a average of 8000 per gun and u get around 500 acres to yourself. What is left in that county as far as public and access to anyone is under 200 acres. I can take a pic of road and parking area on a typical weekend and there will be more cars than acres. How does that stack up pressure wise? Just my opinion of license sales are a bit deceiving in reguards to pressure.

Again not trying to stir the pot or even claim what I referred to is correct just is a fact that it's what I have always heard and could personally careless either way. My own actual opinion is states including my own who are sub par is self induced by hunters who want the best of both worlds. Kill anything they see and gripe about no big ones. From the folks I know in the whitetail great states, they have just as many dink young deer as anywhere else. The diff is they don't shoot them and restrict the out of state hunters who do.

[mauser06]

I live and grew up hunting Pennsylvania...mostly public with private that most anyone else could hunt.


I hunted the NW lower peninsula of Michigan during the 2016 and 2017 gun openers.


All I heard about was pressure. It'll sound like a war zone. Guys everywhere. That was LOCAL info as well as forums. I was quite nervous.

Opening day of 2016 I parked pretty early. Not a truck around. I had a little over a mile hike in. I was basically situated between all 3 access points and pretty much smack in the center and in a fairly good terrain funnel. I settled in. Never seen another light coming. Day broke. No orange to be seen. About an hour after light I hadn't heard a shot yet. I got pretty nervous thinking maybe I mistook the date. Got on the phone. Nov15. Checked the date...nov15. Hmmmm?


I sat dark to dark. Never had a hunter come through. Heard maybe 8 distant shots. Wasn't till dang near dark that I saw deer. 8 does came feeding through. Deer feeding at the end of opening day on public land? No pressured movement???


In 2 seasons up there, I think I ran into 1 hunter total. I did a fair bit of still hunting and never came across anyone. It's basically the only public in the area.

I've learned pressure is relative. Most public I've seen opening day of PA, you can't get away from the crowd. One year I hiked to the deepest darkest spot on a piece of public. I still had orange visible on a couple sides of me and people walking around nearly all day.


Where I hunted things are IMO a bit skewed. There's deer...but not a ton. The surrounding private seems much better... probably due to food. Buck size is also skewed cause of APRs in the county. I passed the only buck I had a shot at on the opener of 17...a legal 5 point but basically a spike with legal points. I seen plenty driving and such. And I lived there for 2 years off n on...

A guy I met that hunted not too far from that spot killed 2 there a couple years prior. I think 125 and 135" bucks a day apart. I think they aged at 3.5 and 4.5. Not really "out of the norm".


Michigan is a big state. And vastly different as you travel it. The southern portion is not like the northern. The upper peninsula is a world of it's own.

I think a lot of the public is just hard to hunt. Some of the public swamps and marshes are nearly endless. No doubt in my mind there are bucks dying of old age in there that never seen a person.

I agree...the long gun season and 2 buck tags definitely skews things. Especially in areas of low deer density. The first season I did a lot of walking and wasn't coming across many deer. Actually just a handful. The 2nd season, weather was better and I had Intel to go from so I sat a little more.

I am 90% sure I saw a 100" or so shooter in 16. I caught a rack behind a downed tree. 2 doe stepped out and went into the swamp. The next day I looked at the spot and the log was on top of a small rise. I didn't know it at the time or I'd probably stood up. I think he scent checked them and turned around. That evening I was following a buck down the edge of the swamp ripping up scrapes and testing trees apart. I sat down with 2 hours of light left. Didn't know the terrain and it cost me. I'm pretty confident I saw a good rack.

I've seen several 100+" bucks up there not hunting.

But like I said, it's a big state and not created equal.

My biggest thing was the locals talking about the pressure....it was literally laughable compared to what I'm used to. 2 opening days combined and I hear more shots before legal light in PA than I did there lol

[Drewo]

Next complaint is pressure. How is pressure proven by license sales? Give an example from a county in my state. First off 99% of the state is privately owned yet. Particular county I speak of is primarily owned by 3 ranches which leases for a average of 8000 per gun and u get around 500 acres to yourself. What is left in that county as far as public and access to anyone is under 200 acres. I can take a pic of road and parking area on a typical weekend and there will be more cars than acres. How does that stack up pressure wise? Just my opinion of license sales are a bit deceiving in reguards to pressure.
.

I’d say crowded doesn’t mean pressured. There many counties in michigan with tons of public land and it all gets hunted. Those deer get no break and they learn quick or die. All the cars you mention to hunt 200acres just mean the deer leave those 200acres and go to the 400 empty ones on that 500acre lease.

[jmaas07]

I can't speak for the whole state, only where I have hunted and I can say I have been through a good amount of counties in Michigan and the deer just get hammered on, both public and private. Theres lots of small private properties and most have box blinds or tree stands that are visable just driving by, guys are stacked up like condos. Go scout public, there are stands everywhere, even way out in swamps where you think people wouldn't go, they go. The good spots are few and far between and they take a fair amount of time to find and figure out. You have to pound ground. By the time bucks are 2.5 they are educated. We deal with heavy pressure and bucks know the game at a young age. You have to work real hard here for your opportunities at good bucks.

[Dewey]

I can't speak for the whole state, only where I have hunted and I can say I have been through a good amount of counties in Michigan and the deer just get hammered on, both public and private. Theres lots of small private properties and most have box blinds or tree stands that are visable just driving by, guys are stacked up like condos. Go scout public, there are stands everywhere, even way out in swamps where you think people wouldn't go, they go. The good spots are few and far between and they take a fair amount of time to find and figure out. You have to pound ground. By the time bucks are 2.5 they are educated. We deal with heavy pressure and bucks know the game at a young age. You have to work real hard here for your opportunities at good bucks.

Sure sounds exactly like Wisconsin.

[oldrank]

I can't speak for the whole state, only where I have hunted and I can say I have been through a good amount of counties in Michigan and the deer just get hammered on, both public and private. Theres lots of small private properties and most have box blinds or tree stands that are visable just driving by, guys are stacked up like condos. Go scout public, there are stands everywhere, even way out in swamps where you think people wouldn't go, they go. The good spots are few and far between and they take a fair amount of time to find and figure out. You have to pound ground. By the time bucks are 2.5 they are educated. We deal with heavy pressure and bucks know the game at a young age. You have to work real hard here for your opportunities at good bucks.

Exactly.

[Joe68]

If anyone is on instagram check out mibuckpole. There’s no big bucks in Michigan.

[mipubbucks24]

The problem with Michigan has nothing to do with genetics, at least not in the souther half of the lower pensula. It is the 2 buck tags that overall really take down the buck numbers.

Michigan is improving, there are more big bucks being taken every year, but it’s still not even close to more western states like Iowa, Kansas, Missouri, even Wisconsin or Indiana.

The gun season in Michigan has really changed. Growing up I Hunted in the Owoso area at my Uncles farm and it was a war zone, you could count shots non stop till about 10:30 in the morning. This last year I hunted Saint Joseph County opening day and only heard 10 shots all morning.

I hunted a piece of Public last year that is about 2500 acres, and there were at least 200 hundred cars parked around the property, I could see 5 people from my stand in the morning. But the pressure is relative because on the 10 mile drive home I did not see a single car parked along all the private on the way home. The pressure was all in small areas.

There is a reason basically no one comes to the state of Michigan to hunt trophy bucks, there are just less of them. It’s not that they don’t exists there are just less of them, and that is due to the 2 buck limit and the shear number of hunters.

[DEERSLAYER]

Michigan is not top 10 in B&C every year. Not even close (although that may change) and the B&C we do have mostly come from a very small area of the state that has rich farmland and is almost entirely private.

As far as genetics goes, as a whole we have great genetics in most places despite what many people (who mostly shoot yearlings) claim. Give them quality food, cover and some age and they can get as big as anywhere.

Wisconsin has been the world leader in P&Y bucks for a very long time and is sometimes the leader in B&C as well. They have been far and away the leader for trophy bucks for many years. Michigan cannot compare to Wisconsin when it comes to trophy hunting accessible to the average guy. Nor other states like Iowa. Illinois, Ohio, Kansas and several others.

[DEERSLAYER]

The problem with Michigan has nothing to do with genetics, at least not in the souther half of the lower pensula. It is the 2 buck tags that overall really take down the buck numbers...

I have heard this plenty of times and will disagree with it all day long. There are isolated area's where it would make some difference but not like you think. We have too much hunting going on in most places because we don't just have numbers but our hunters tend to put in a lot of hours in the field. Very few people get a second buck in most of the state because in most areas a yearling will not get 4 points on a side so when a second yearling buck (like a spike through six point) gets passed by someone that already has one buck it normally gets shot by another so that almost nothing survives to advance to the next year class. Go to one buck and the same thing happens in almost all the area's. Just like it did when we had a one buck tag for many years. You have to figure in hunter numbers, amount of public land and hunter dynamics when figuring out what going to one buck tag would do. We are not the same as other states like Indiana that have done it. Not to mention Michigan is quite the poaching state. Lots of guys on private farms will buy a second tag for their wife, daughter, son, etc and fill it themselves just like was so common before the second buck tag came about.

The way that makes the biggest difference BY FAR is antler restrictions. You have to force guys to pass them to change our culture. It would be nice if our DNR would put in the proper AP's for producing big bucks but at least having the 3 point on a side rule in area's where most yearling bucks don't get that many points on a side is getting many of them through a Michigan season which makes them much harder to kill and that has resulted in quite a few mature bucks. I only wish I was set up to hunt the AR zone! Maybe one of these days.

[mipubbucks24]

The problem with Michigan has nothing to do with genetics, at least not in the souther half of the lower pensula. It is the 2 buck tags that overall really take down the buck numbers...

I have heard this plenty of times and will disagree with it all day long. There are isolated area's where it would make some difference but not like you think. We have too much hunting going on in most places because we don't just have numbers but our hunters tend to put in a lot of hours in the field. Very few people get a second buck in most of the state because in most areas a yearling will not get 4 points on a side so when a second yearling buck (like a spike through six point) gets passed by someone that already has one buck it normally gets shot by another so that almost nothing survives to advance to the next year class. Go to one buck and the same thing happens in almost all the area's. Just like it did when we had a one buck tag for many years. You have to figure in hunter numbers, amount of public land and hunter dynamics when figuring out what going to one buck tag would do. We are not the same as other states like Indiana that have done it. Not to mention Michigan is quite the poaching state. Lots of guys on private farms will buy a second tag for their wife, daughter, son, etc and fill it themselves just like was so common before the second buck tag came about.

The way that makes the biggest difference BY FAR is antler restrictions. You have to force guys to pass them to change our culture. It would be nice if our DNR would put in the proper AP's for producing big bucks but at least having the 3 point on a side rule in area's where most yearling bucks don't get that many points on a side is getting many of them through a Michigan season which makes them much harder to kill and that has resulted in quite a few mature bucks. I only wish I was set up to hunt the AR zone! Maybe one of these days.

Can’t say I disagree with your logic. I guess my theory is if you only have 1 buck tag then you are much more picky on what you shoot. I would love for Michigan to go to mandated 4 or 3 on one side apr.

[Stretch]

Imo the mentality of our hunters is slowly changing for the better. The olderguys that i know just dont get the idea of letting the young bucks go, if its legal it down. This year my 17 yr old nephew let a small 8pt walk because "it was too young" while my 64 yr old brother inlaw shot a spike because " it gave me a good shot". I think if cwd dont devastate the herd our best deer hunting is still ahead of us. We NEED apr's to force everyone to do it.

[218er]

Very interesting read. It sounds very similar to Minnesota. I’d guess 3/4 + of MN hunters would shoot anything legal. Additionally very few hunters talk age class
at all outside of SE MN. It’s often about points. A basket 8 is the gold standard.

[wmihunter]

The problem with Michigan has nothing to do with genetics, at least not in the souther half of the lower pensula. It is the 2 buck tags that overall really take down the buck numbers...

I have heard this plenty of times and will disagree with it all day long. There are isolated area's where it would make some difference but not like you think. We have too much hunting going on in most places because we don't just have numbers but our hunters tend to put in a lot of hours in the field. Very few people get a second buck in most of the state because in most areas a yearling will not get 4 points on a side so when a second yearling buck (like a spike through six point) gets passed by someone that already has one buck it normally gets shot by another so that almost nothing survives to advance to the next year class. Go to one buck and the same thing happens in almost all the area's. Just like it did when we had a one buck tag for many years. You have to figure in hunter numbers, amount of public land and hunter dynamics when figuring out what going to one buck tag would do. We are not the same as other states like Indiana that have done it. Not to mention Michigan is quite the poaching state. Lots of guys on private farms will buy a second tag for their wife, daughter, son, etc and fill it themselves just like was so common before the second buck tag came about.

The way that makes the biggest difference BY FAR is antler restrictions. You have to force guys to pass them to change our culture. It would be nice if our DNR would put in the proper AP's for producing big bucks but at least having the 3 point on a side rule in area's where most yearling bucks don't get that many points on a side is getting many of them through a Michigan season which makes them much harder to kill and that has resulted in quite a few mature bucks. I only wish I was set up to hunt the AR zone! Maybe one of these days.

Mi hunters seem to break the law more readily than other states. It’s just like our speeding issues. The officers are slack to enforce speeding compared to other states like Ohio and Texas. You can go about 10 over before you are pulled over.