The "red zone"...

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dan
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Re: The "red zone"...

Unread postby dan » Tue Dec 04, 2012 8:56 pm

It's funny though, I have always been one to wait for the perfect shot. My dad is not one of those people. He takes the first shot that he is offered. Proof is in the results that he has put down many more deer than I have in the years that i have been hunting. Again, not advocating for taking bad shots and he doesn't take bad shots, but I think there is some truth that the shot forcers knock down more deer than the perfect shot waiters.

The "perfect shot" is a rare thing in hunting... I take the 1st good shot that is offered.


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Re: The "red zone"...

Unread postby dan » Tue Dec 04, 2012 9:00 pm

exojam wrote:
DropTyne wrote:
dan wrote:
Edcyclopedia wrote:
dan wrote:My set ups are usually pretty close to the buck and where he stages every time he uses a certain bedding area... Before the trails split.


What do you reccommend for clumbsy hunters (less stealthy).
Windy days or...?

Try harder... Walk slower...
I think if you have an issue sneaking that last hundred yards its probably due to a lack of confidence, or belief that the buck is really there. I think all of us go at un-natural speeds because of our fast paced work and play life... In the woods everything moves slow. Except people.


One of the hardest skills I ever learned. Just keep reminding yourself you are HUNTING not rushing.

[ Post made via iPad ] Image



So I must ask even though I have never been close to a mature deer but hope to one day.

How would you go about getting close if you could not walk, like in my case and have to use either a wheelchair of some type of electric scooter to get into the woods? Unfortunately I just cannot be as quit as most people. Would a mature deer or even young deer possibly not be “so worried” about sounds like that compared to footsteps or would any deer be on alert with any abnormal noise?

What about the noise from setting up a blind since I cannot get into a tree? Would you forgo the blind and just stay in the chair or scooter?

Please take these as honest questions since they are. Just looking for what experienced guys would suggest.

Also, I just quoted from DropTyne since his post contained the section for my question (with all the quotes he has in there).

James

James,
Your situation is unique to most of us. You certainly have some road blocks. If I were in your situation, I would try and wrap up a piece of private land and have someone put small food plots in close to the bedding areas that have a good access for you to get to a blind that is blocked from the food plot so deer can't wander over and smell you have hunted there easily.
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Re: The "red zone"...

Unread postby dan » Tue Dec 04, 2012 9:08 pm

6) Deciding when to draw back my bow....sounds very basic but its been a struggle for me.

Thats a big one a lot of guys don't consider... another reason you have to kill some deer to get good at killing deer... In my opinion most people draw there bow to soon, or when the buck is behind brush. I almost always wait till a shot is present before I draw the bow. The buck will often pick up the movement and there you sit at full draw with no shot and the buck staring you down. Or he stops to eat, or turns and your at full draw to long and start to shake or have to let down...

If you draw and the buck is presenting a shot and he sees you, most of the time he hesitates with plenty of time to take the shot.
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Re: The "red zone"...

Unread postby exojam » Tue Dec 04, 2012 11:29 pm

dan wrote:
exojam wrote:
DropTyne wrote:
dan wrote:
Edcyclopedia wrote:
dan wrote:My set ups are usually pretty close to the buck and where he stages every time he uses a certain bedding area... Before the trails split.


What do you reccommend for clumbsy hunters (less stealthy).
Windy days or...?

Try harder... Walk slower...
I think if you have an issue sneaking that last hundred yards its probably due to a lack of confidence, or belief that the buck is really there. I think all of us go at un-natural speeds because of our fast paced work and play life... In the woods everything moves slow. Except people.


One of the hardest skills I ever learned. Just keep reminding yourself you are HUNTING not rushing.

[ Post made via iPad ] Image



So I must ask even though I have never been close to a mature deer but hope to one day.

How would you go about getting close if you could not walk, like in my case and have to use either a wheelchair of some type of electric scooter to get into the woods? Unfortunately I just cannot be as quit as most people. Would a mature deer or even young deer possibly not be “so worried” about sounds like that compared to footsteps or would any deer be on alert with any abnormal noise?

What about the noise from setting up a blind since I cannot get into a tree? Would you forgo the blind and just stay in the chair or scooter?

Please take these as honest questions since they are. Just looking for what experienced guys would suggest.

Also, I just quoted from DropTyne since his post contained the section for my question (with all the quotes he has in there).

James

James,
Your situation is unique to most of us. You certainly have some road blocks. If I were in your situation, I would try and wrap up a piece of private land and have someone put small food plots in close to the bedding areas that have a good access for you to get to a blind that is blocked from the food plot so deer can't wander over and smell you have hunted there easily.



Dan,

Thank you very much for the reply.

It is funny you mention the food plots as one of the guys I hunt with at the rod and gun club has been briefly mentioning these. I was going to start a thread in another section to discuss this soon and get some thoughts, opinions. My only concern there is if a few food plots go up, most hunters at the club will end up knowing and I am sure they will be over hunted. Another option is to speak with my friend who owns about 14 acres in town that has deer on it, coming through it, maybe something there. I checked (I believe Deerslayers) webpage (Slayerseed) for food sources and those prices do not look bad at all.

James
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Re: The "red zone"...

Unread postby NatureBoy » Tue Dec 04, 2012 11:48 pm

dan wrote:Most guys in my opinion are to conservative and set up to far back.

This has been my "red zone" issue more often than not. Also, I am learning that I hunt better from the ground than in a treestand. My success rate and deer sightings is way higher from the ground. But in previous years, my lack of confidence on the ground has cost me two really nice mature bucks. I'm also a poor gun shot. I practice all year round with my bow, and am totally confident with it. But I've lost my share of nice bucks due to lack of practice with the gun, one just last week. Every year it's on my list of things to do, but somehow I don't make time for it. That's gotta change.
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Re: The "red zone"...

Unread postby Scot » Wed Dec 05, 2012 12:44 am

I really appreciate the humility of some excellent hunters here! Reading through the replies I can relate to many. Unfortunately my biggest issue by far is finding big bucks. The age class of our bucks has improved tremendously over the last few years because of antler restrictions yet I have not been putting myself in a position to have opportunities at our better bucks. The last two years I have killed the best buck I have seen in one of my hunting area's. Both of these bucks were 2.5 year olds. I still get more jacked up at the shot than I would wish to but I am getting better at that.
My biggest challenge is getting myself in the red zone on 3.5 year old and older bucks.
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Re: The "red zone"...

Unread postby Southern Man » Wed Dec 05, 2012 1:57 am

Suprisingly, I feel fairly confident in the red zone.... once I get there. I'm comfortable waiting for the shot, angle of the shot doesn't bother me, and I will rush the shot if I need to. Not to say I'm not nervous or that my blood isn't racing thru my veins like a freight train and I have made a bunch of mistakes at the moment of truth. For me age is getting to be the biggest obsticle on getting to the red zone. My vision isn't what it use to be, my drive is starting to wain, and things are getting harder and harder to do. The want to is still there but the execution is lacking. I think alot of that comes from knowing that I don't have to kill anymore. Not saying you guys feel like you must "kill" to be sucessful. But I put alot of pressure on myself in the past to get it done with only 1 acceptable outcome, to kill. I don't feel that way anymore.
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Re: The "red zone"...

Unread postby Redman232 » Wed Dec 05, 2012 3:00 am

Problem number one for me used to be not being ready when they showed up. I had my bow on a bow hanger all the time and it seemed like I was always fumbling around. Now it's in my hand where it needs to be to shoot. I would stand and stretch my legs, now I sit and rest my legs, as it's easier for me to move while standing. I try to stand for at least an hour and sit for 5 minutes or so. Second problem I thought was my climber. I would sneak all the way to a tree and then get all hot, sweaty and angry trying to climb the stupid tree. I bought a LW and thought this is great, just is fast as a climber and more quiet. First hunt I end up all hot, sweaty and angry trying to climb the stupid tree. The problem wasn't the stand it was the dumb impatient hunter trying to use it. Now I consistently remind myself to go slow while walking in, while hanging the stand and with any movement while I'm on stand. Taking a break a 100 yards or so from the stand is essential for me. I also very slowly unpack my stand and climbing sticks and position them where they are readily accessible at the base of the tree and I will make five quiet trips(4 climbing sticks and 1 stand up the tree instead of one or two noisy trips.
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Re: The "red zone"...

Unread postby woody-san » Wed Dec 05, 2012 3:09 am

I think your equipment (harness, stands, clothing, release, etc.) is a big factor in the Red Zone.

-I used to hunt out of a Summit Viper, but I noticed that the rail surrounding me on the upper part of the stand lended itself to making noise when something on your belt, pocket, or harness makes contact with it. I use a LW Assualt now, problem solved.

-Back to the tree stand issue, I feel I've had deer see my climbing sticks...I've switched to the tan LW straps to hang my sticks as they blend into the bark better and I hang my sticks so that they aren't visible from the direction I suspect deer to be coming from.

-This year I had a nice 10 come right in on me. As he approached, I only had shots that presented 1 lung. He went behind my tree and as I turned to get a quartering away shot, I became entangled in my safety harness. I eventually came free, drew on him, but my elbow got entangled in my harness and the velcro on my gloves caught my knit hat and pulled it off my head. During my attempt to get my elbow around my harness, my back tension release went off and the arrow sailed well over the deer. Now I have my harness set up differently to avoid such a thing. I also need to work out my glove situation, get some that don't have velcro

-I've heard of some guys using mechanicals having problems with them opening while on the rest (heard this issue a lot with Rage's), I use a fixed blade head, no possibility of worrying about the head opening up during my draw

-Let's face it, most of us get out in the woods with 4 or less hours of sleep under our belts. In years past I've nodded off in the stand. Who knows what came by? You can't kill them if you're sleeping. I've started taking a 5 Hour Energy into the stand with me. It's small enough to be unnoticable in your bag/pack/pocket, and it perks you right up.

There's enough variables outside of our little worlds 15' up, it's important to control everything we can up there.

Just $0.02 from a beast in training.
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Re: The "red zone"...

Unread postby Stanley » Wed Dec 05, 2012 3:53 am

Great thread lots of information to chew on.
You can fool some of the bucks, all of the time, and fool all of the bucks, some of the time, however you certainly can't fool all of the bucks, all of the time.
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Re: The "red zone"...

Unread postby backstraps » Wed Dec 05, 2012 4:08 am

After reading many post on here, I can relate to many.
Thinking back at some problems I have had inside the red zone at the moment of truth my biggest obstacle is my hearing.

Extreme loud music, blasting guns, machinery, etc etc when I was younger has taken it toll on my ears. If I dont see it coming in it is usually on me before I have a good chance to react.. and to be quite honest it is very tough for me to not put the bow in a holder. Holding it for several hours isnt very practical for me.

The most recent big shooter I had come in that I didnt seal the deal was because my bow was on a hanger when he cruised in. The second I seen him he was in range. Grabbing the bow getting drawn and shooting him undetected wasnt happening. He busted me and was gone.

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Re: The "red zone"...

Unread postby Chris Conroy » Wed Dec 05, 2012 5:01 am

For me the "Red Zone" starts the moment I step into the woods. I have hunted a certain way for over 26 years, and old habits die hard. My whole life I was bombarded with information from magazines, books, videos, and friends and relatives that hunted. Just about everything I learned was just the opposite of what to do on heavy pressure public land bucks. Making the changes needed to connect on these deer have caused me to abandon a lot of ideas and methods that I used all my life to shoot my buck every year and fill every tag I could get. It's pretty humbling to come on this site and see a new kill thread with someone holding a monster buck every time I check. More than a few times I have thought about drawing on a 6 or small 8 that walks out of an area that I was expecting my target buck to be bedded. The big bucks that I did set up on and see always left on a different trail then I had anticipated them using. I didn't scout as much as I should have, and the beds that I did find last Spring were not being used much this year. I don't know if the drought or other factors caused the deer to move to different areas, but it was pretty frustrating to say the least.
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Re: The "red zone"...

Unread postby dan » Wed Dec 05, 2012 5:12 am

Dan,

Thank you very much for the reply.

It is funny you mention the food plots as one of the guys I hunt with at the rod and gun club has been briefly mentioning these. I was going to start a thread in another section to discuss this soon and get some thoughts, opinions. My only concern there is if a few food plots go up, most hunters at the club will end up knowing and I am sure they will be over hunted. Another option is to speak with my friend who owns about 14 acres in town that has deer on it, coming through it, maybe something there. I checked (I believe Deerslayers) webpage (Slayerseed) for food sources and those prices do not look bad at all.

James

James,
The crimson trail seed blend Deerslayer has is working really well for me... The expense is not in the seed, but if you fertilize properly, that adds up a little. But you don't need a huge food plot. A small 20 foot one will work just fine.
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Re: The "red zone"...

Unread postby dan » Wed Dec 05, 2012 5:16 am

Southern Man wrote:Suprisingly, I feel fairly confident in the red zone.... once I get there. I'm comfortable waiting for the shot, angle of the shot doesn't bother me, and I will rush the shot if I need to. Not to say I'm not nervous or that my blood isn't racing thru my veins like a freight train and I have made a bunch of mistakes at the moment of truth. For me age is getting to be the biggest obsticle on getting to the red zone. My vision isn't what it use to be, my drive is starting to wain, and things are getting harder and harder to do. The want to is still there but the execution is lacking. I think alot of that comes from knowing that I don't have to kill anymore. Not saying you guys feel like you must "kill" to be sucessful. But I put alot of pressure on myself in the past to get it done with only 1 acceptable outcome, to kill. I don't feel that way anymore.

Wow... Sounds a lot like me!
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Re: The "red zone"...

Unread postby Stanley » Wed Dec 05, 2012 5:21 am

Southern Man wrote:Suprisingly, I feel fairly confident in the red zone.... once I get there. I'm comfortable waiting for the shot, angle of the shot doesn't bother me, and I will rush the shot if I need to. Not to say I'm not nervous or that my blood isn't racing thru my veins like a freight train and I have made a bunch of mistakes at the moment of truth. For me age is getting to be the biggest obsticle on getting to the red zone. My vision isn't what it use to be, my drive is starting to wain, and things are getting harder and harder to do. The want to is still there but the execution is lacking. I think alot of that comes from knowing that I don't have to kill anymore. Not saying you guys feel like you must "kill" to be sucessful. But I put alot of pressure on myself in the past to get it done with only 1 acceptable outcome, to kill. I don't feel that way anymore.

The young guys may not understand but I sure do.
You can fool some of the bucks, all of the time, and fool all of the bucks, some of the time, however you certainly can't fool all of the bucks, all of the time.


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