Rub input wanted!

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Zap
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Rub input wanted!

Unread postby Zap » Sat Feb 04, 2012 5:48 am

I would appreciate some input on this subject. :mrgreen:

When you are scouting and come across a rub that is obviously from this season.
But not hit very hard or recently, looks like five months old....or the same for a small trashed tree/bush.

Do you believe that is a area that a buck rubbed to get velvet off?
Can a few of these rubs indicate a core area?


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RaisedByWolves
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Re: Rub input wanted!

Unread postby RaisedByWolves » Sat Feb 04, 2012 5:56 am

good question Marty. I got lucky one time and found a small rub in Sept, that still had blood and a little velvet stuck to the tree. Couldn't really learn much from it though. I've always wondered if that 1st velvet rub is usually aggressive or more careful. I imagine it would be fairly aggressive and would leave all kinds of unique marks on the tree from rubbing at all the different angles.
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Re: Rub input wanted!

Unread postby JRM6868 » Sat Feb 04, 2012 6:02 am

I have a travel area that has light rubs down to tore up. It's used by multiple bucks and I think the light rubs are just where a buck maybe started and got distracted and moved on or sometimes you get young bucks rubbing a bigger than normal tree for them and they can't dig in as much. The bucks show up on this property mid to late October so I know it's not velvet rubbing.
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Re: Rub input wanted!

Unread postby phade » Sat Feb 04, 2012 6:12 am

I think it depends on the type of ground you hunt.

Here where I hunt in ag land with broken woodlots, the rub lines of that nature may or may not be useful. In many instances, the buck could be rubbing to or from a food source, or even in a core area for that time of year. The problem in this environment (assuming you want to use it to your advantage) is crop harvesting and rotation. In my area, this is largely corn and alfalfa with some beans mixed in. Once that corn starts coming down, the core areas shift enough that the early rub lines really don't help get that buck killed in a subsequent year. The fields don't come down in the same order each year nor is there a gurantee of what that field will be next season.

Most of the lots I hunt are hedgerows with 10-15 acre woodlots. If corn gets cleared out enough, they may shift to another lot or corn field, or even move into a few brushy areas right next to a few homes. With small acreage being common here, it's a big factor to killing a mature buck. Especially when you consider our season starts mid Oct.

The bushes in my area that are rubbed often tend to be hit right around velvet shedding and then again as the increased daylight roaming starts to occur. I've see more mature bucks rub bushes than solid trees while in the stand in late October and early November...and there's plenty of rubbing trees available. I think they use the bushes early to get the velvet off of nooks and crannies of the rack.
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Re: Rub input wanted!

Unread postby RaisedByWolves » Sat Feb 04, 2012 6:15 am

phade wrote:I think it depends on the type of ground you hunt.

Here where I hunt in ag land with broken woodlots, the rub lines of that nature may or may not be useful. In many instances, the buck could be rubbing to or from a food source, or even in a core area for that time of year. The problem in this environment (assuming you want to use it to your advantage) is crop harvesting and rotation. In my area, this is largely corn and alfalfa with some beans mixed in. Once that corn starts coming down, the core areas shift enough that the early rub lines really don't help get that buck killed in a subsequent year. The fields don't come down in the same order each year nor is there a gurantee of what that field will be next season.

Most of the lots I hunt are hedgerows with 10-15 acre woodlots. If corn gets cleared out enough, they may shift to another lot or corn field, or even move into a few brushy areas right next to a few homes. With small acreage being common here, it's a big factor to killing a mature buck. Especially when you consider our season starts mid Oct.

The bushes in my area that are rubbed often tend to be hit right around velvet shedding and then again as the increased daylight roaming starts to occur. I've see more mature bucks rub bushes than solid trees while in the stand in late October and early November...and there's plenty of rubbing trees available. I think they use the bushes early to get the velvet off of nooks and crannies of the rack.


good info, what state are you in phade?
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Re: Rub input wanted!

Unread postby Southern Man » Sat Feb 04, 2012 6:42 am

Not sure I think a buck "rubs" his velvet off. I've read it both ways. One thing for sure tho, if he rubbed there, he was there for a reason. And I like to know the reason. Just one more part of the puzzle. If it has to do with a core area, there should be more sign around to make that call.
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Re: Rub input wanted!

Unread postby phade » Sat Feb 04, 2012 6:49 am

RaisedByWolves wrote:
phade wrote:I think it depends on the type of ground you hunt.

Here where I hunt in ag land with broken woodlots, the rub lines of that nature may or may not be useful. In many instances, the buck could be rubbing to or from a food source, or even in a core area for that time of year. The problem in this environment (assuming you want to use it to your advantage) is crop harvesting and rotation. In my area, this is largely corn and alfalfa with some beans mixed in. Once that corn starts coming down, the core areas shift enough that the early rub lines really don't help get that buck killed in a subsequent year. The fields don't come down in the same order each year nor is there a gurantee of what that field will be next season.

Most of the lots I hunt are hedgerows with 10-15 acre woodlots. If corn gets cleared out enough, they may shift to another lot or corn field, or even move into a few brushy areas right next to a few homes. With small acreage being common here, it's a big factor to killing a mature buck. Especially when you consider our season starts mid Oct.

The bushes in my area that are rubbed often tend to be hit right around velvet shedding and then again as the increased daylight roaming starts to occur. I've see more mature bucks rub bushes than solid trees while in the stand in late October and early November...and there's plenty of rubbing trees available. I think they use the bushes early to get the velvet off of nooks and crannies of the rack.


good info, what state are you in phade?



I'm in western NY.
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phade
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Re: Rub input wanted!

Unread postby phade » Sat Feb 04, 2012 6:57 am

Southern Man wrote:Not sure I think a buck "rubs" his velvet off. I've read it both ways. One thing for sure tho, if he rubbed there, he was there for a reason. And I like to know the reason. Just one more part of the puzzle. If it has to do with a core area, there should be more sign around to make that call.



Problem being is that you won't necessarily know both why and when he was there in my enviornment without additional info not gleaing from scouting. Knowing BOTH why and when is important. Determining it's "early season" isn't enough during post-season scouting. You need to know if the surrounding corn field was harvested October 5 or October 25. That makes a huge difference. Some fields will tend to be cut later in the year...maybe a low spot that hangs on to the last wet weather, or just because it is a larger field where the farm cannot hold in its grain storage in combination to its other fields. That's where you maybe be able to use such a rub line or cluster to your advantage the following year. Unfortunately, it usually takes a few years on the same ground to start figuring that out.
Last edited by phade on Sat Feb 04, 2012 7:00 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Zap
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Re: Rub input wanted!

Unread postby Zap » Sat Feb 04, 2012 6:59 am

Southern Man wrote:Not sure I think a buck "rubs" his velvet off. I've read it both ways. One thing for sure tho, if he rubbed there, he was there for a reason. And I like to know the reason. Just one more part of the puzzle. If it has to do with a core area, there should be more sign around to make that call.



Hunting pressure on public around here shifts buck bedding off of wildlife areas, hard to see alot of sign this time of year.
They shift back on in spring/summer, IMO.
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Re: Rub input wanted!

Unread postby venisonassassin » Sat Feb 04, 2012 10:53 am

This is a good topic. I wonder if I've put too much stock in rubs while scouting over the years. Obviously a buck has been there because a rub is there, but what about rubs that are made during the rut? I think I have probably confused these as to signs of a bucks core area. From what I've learned bucks rub less as they age and as they age they get bigger and taller and their rubs are higher on the tree, but how many of these rubs are an indication of their travel routes and where the buck beds? I guess I have more questions than answers.
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Re: Rub input wanted!

Unread postby Brad » Sat Feb 04, 2012 2:43 pm

I would suggest reading Greg Millers book "rub line secrets", one of the best hunting books I have ever read and a lot of it is based of big woods in the national forests etc. I think every hunter should be required to read this book at least once along with a few of his others.
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Re: Rub input wanted!

Unread postby venisonassassin » Sat Feb 04, 2012 6:52 pm

Funny thing is I have that book lol. I'll have to blow the dust off and read it again.


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