Hill Country Bucks ?

[tds]

Hello, been viewing for the past couple years and have been bow hunting for the past 30 years.. Just purchased the video of Hill Country bucks.. I really enjoyed the video and helps explain why I had some success.. I hunt the ridges of SE MN, and have a question in regards to the wind tunnel that one can find 1/3 of the way down the ridge.

Some of the ridges are fairly steep and wonder how that effects the prevailing winds and the thermals. I assume the steeper the ridge the closer one is to the top correct ? Otherwise wouldn't the prevailing wind just blow over the deer ?

Also buckthorn has taken over most of the area I hunt.. Has anyone done any work to combat this nasty stuff ? Or have you noticed travel patterns being altered because of it ?

[tds]

bump

[rfickes87]

I just took a quick gander at your area in SE MN and looked at your hills, they're quite typical to what I hunt in PA and my general understanding of buck bedding. I see you have a well defined military crest on almost all of your slopes. That sharp crest drop off will allow for a strong "eddy" suction effect with the wind blowing over the ridge and the thermals rising. A sharp crest like that will make bedding more consistent. A gradual rolling crest will make bedding less consistent (elevation wise). When you're standing there midday you'll feel the wind seemingly blowing in opposite directions. That'll be ideal for buck bedding especially when they have some sort of thick cover (mostly to their back). When your ridge lines span with multiple points for bedding that would be ideal to sit that crest and expect deer travel. Or even a "Hub" where a large valley is surrounded by 2 or more converging ridges that type of terrain will swirl and create those eddy currents in all sorts of directions and create a safe haven for bucks.


In regards to buckthorn, I've read about it before but I don't worry about it. If its really bad in your area I would think that would actually be a benefit for you. Walk some of those ridges this spring and scout the bedding. As your walking I'm sure you'll find where the thorn is too thick to walk and where it does allow for travel. Should make for some nice pinch funnels for travel.

Not sure if i'm helping you?

[tds]

I just took a quick gander at your area in SE MN and looked at your hills, they're quite typical to what I hunt in PA and my general understanding of buck bedding. I see you have a well defined military crest on almost all of your slopes. That sharp crest drop off will allow for a strong "eddy" suction effect with the wind blowing over the ridge and the thermals rising. A sharp crest like that will make bedding more consistent. A gradual rolling crest will make bedding less consistent (elevation wise). When you're standing there midday you'll feel the wind seemingly blowing in opposite directions. That'll be ideal for buck bedding especially when they have some sort of thick cover (mostly to their back). When your ridge lines span with multiple points for bedding that would be ideal to sit that crest and expect deer travel. Or even a "Hub" where a large valley is surrounded by 2 or more converging ridges that type of terrain will swirl and create those eddy currents in all sorts of directions and create a safe haven for bucks.


In regards to buckthorn, I've read about it before but I don't worry about it. If its really bad in your area I would think that would actually be a benefit for you. Walk some of those ridges this spring and scout the bedding. As your walking I'm sure you'll find where the thorn is too thick to walk and where it does allow for travel. Should make for some nice pinch funnels for travel.

Not sure if i'm helping you?

Yep thanks !!! So as long as one can feel both the prevailing and thermal one is in the thermal tunnel ? I have some milk weed to help identify.. The bucks definetly bed on the edges of the points so they can see down the bluff as well as utilize both prevailing and thermals. I was just trying to get a better feel of the 1/3 from top of the ridge..


The buckthorn has become so thick in some areas you can't see 10 yards let alone shoot 10 yards.

[tds]

That sharp crest drop off will allow for a strong "eddy" suction effect with the wind blowing over the ridge and the thermals rising.

I am guessing where there is a natural steep bank will help funnel the deer on the high side to prevent them from losing the prevailing wind advantage.

[Hatchetman]

I too have hunted the same se mn area.
16 yrs now.

I don’t see so much of the so called “thermal tunnel” action there as in true hill country.
In my experience, wind currents in bluffs vs hills differ.
To me there are very few hills there, meaning they have a slope and a top but don’t slope back down the other side rather they flatten out at the top and usually transition into a large field of some sort
The wind just doesn’t react the same to me on a bluff. I’ve always thought if your set up near the crest on the leewards side of a bluff the prevailing wind will be sliding across the broad flat top verses on a hill where it bangs into the windward slope and rolls over the top is the reason why. The wind over a bluff seems to stay more consistent with the prevailing wind to me.
The more gradual the drop off slope is from the crest the more this will hold true, but even on steeper drop offs I’m still not seeing the backwards up draft on the leeward side like a true hill will generate.

[tds]

I too have hunted the same se mn area.
16 yrs now.

I don’t see so much of the so called “thermal tunnel” action there as in true hill country.
In my experience, wind currents in bluffs vs hills differ.
To me there are very few hills there, meaning they have a slope and a top but don’t slope back down the other side rather they flatten out at the top and usually transition into a large field of some sort
The wind just doesn’t react the same to me on a bluff. I’ve always thought if your set up near the crest on the leewards side of a bluff the prevailing wind will be sliding across the broad flat top verses on a hill where it bangs into the windward slope and rolls over the top is the reason why. The wind over a bluff seems to stay more consistent with the prevailing wind to me.
The more gradual the drop off slope is from the crest the more this will hold true, but even on steeper drop offs I’m still not seeing the backwards up draft on the leeward side like a true hill will generate.

Thanks Hatchetman !!

Here is an example. Yea its more ridges I guess.. So you don't feel the thermals coming up from the valleys in the mornings ? Although the sign is crazy in the valleys, hunting them is nearly impossible with all the swirls. Damn I was hoping now that leaves are gone one could go in there with some milkweed and locate the thermals vs prevailing winds.

[parkerdurham]

Swirling winds can definitely be tough to hunt and hard to figure out. I think it is one of the hardest things to read and research on and then successfully apply in the woods. It requires a lot of "on the job training" so to speak.

For hunting down low, particularly in thermal hubs, I'll wait for a calm morning to hunt it, where rising thermals can take scent straight up. Otherwise, I like to hunt high, generally with the prevailing wind.

[BBH1980]

I just took a quick gander at your area in SE MN and looked at your hills, they're quite typical to what I hunt in PA and my general understanding of buck bedding. I see you have a well defined military crest on almost all of your slopes. That sharp crest drop off will allow for a strong "eddy" suction effect with the wind blowing over the ridge and the thermals rising. A sharp crest like that will make bedding more consistent. A gradual rolling crest will make bedding less consistent (elevation wise). When you're standing there midday you'll feel the wind seemingly blowing in opposite directions. That'll be ideal for buck bedding especially when they have some sort of thick cover (mostly to their back). When your ridge lines span with multiple points for bedding that would be ideal to sit that crest and expect deer travel. Or even a "Hub" where a large valley is surrounded by 2 or more converging ridges that type of terrain will swirl and create those eddy currents in all sorts of directions and create a safe haven for bucks.


In regards to buckthorn, I've read about it before but I don't worry about it. If its really bad in your area I would think that would actually be a benefit for you. Walk some of those ridges this spring and scout the bedding. As your walking I'm sure you'll find where the thorn is too thick to walk and where it does allow for travel. Should make for some nice pinch funnels for travel.

Not sure if i'm helping you?

I am hunting the hills of PA myself. I bought the DVDs and have been on the beast for around a year or so. Some of the hills I hunt are more like mountain terrain with several crests and benches on the way to the top. Climbing about 800-900 ft over 1/2 mile stretch. Lots of Laurel on top. My question is are these like the hills your hunting ? If so are you finding beds on the benches and each crest on the way up the hill or just on that top 1/3? These hills have several military crests to them. I have seen them bed on benches parralel to the hill wind to back but I am not sure if a mature buck would do that..

[rfickes87]

I just took a quick gander at your area in SE MN and looked at your hills, they're quite typical to what I hunt in PA and my general understanding of buck bedding. I see you have a well defined military crest on almost all of your slopes. That sharp crest drop off will allow for a strong "eddy" suction effect with the wind blowing over the ridge and the thermals rising. A sharp crest like that will make bedding more consistent. A gradual rolling crest will make bedding less consistent (elevation wise). When you're standing there midday you'll feel the wind seemingly blowing in opposite directions. That'll be ideal for buck bedding especially when they have some sort of thick cover (mostly to their back). When your ridge lines span with multiple points for bedding that would be ideal to sit that crest and expect deer travel. Or even a "Hub" where a large valley is surrounded by 2 or more converging ridges that type of terrain will swirl and create those eddy currents in all sorts of directions and create a safe haven for bucks.


In regards to buckthorn, I've read about it before but I don't worry about it. If its really bad in your area I would think that would actually be a benefit for you. Walk some of those ridges this spring and scout the bedding. As your walking I'm sure you'll find where the thorn is too thick to walk and where it does allow for travel. Should make for some nice pinch funnels for travel.

Not sure if i'm helping you?

I am hunting the hills of PA myself. I bought the DVDs and have been on the beast for around a year or so. Some of the hills I hunt are more like mountain terrain with several crests and benches on the way to the top. Climbing about 800-900 ft over 1/2 mile stretch. Lots of Laurel on top. My question is are these like the hills your hunting ? If so are you finding beds on the benches and each crest on the way up the hill or just on that top 1/3? These hills have several military crests to them. I have seen them bed on benches parralel to the hill wind to back but I am not sure if a mature buck would do that..

Each crest can have bedding from my own experience. In areas where the ridges are small its really easy to find, its just like Dan will tell you. In the bigger mountainous ridges though, start focusing on knobs, any crest not just the top crest, and sort of transition you can find is worth scouting. Even when your just scoutin, try to plan out your route b/c it'll wear you out so fast, haha.

I almost killed a very nice buck this year opening day in a mountainous setting. The wind wasn't what I had hoped for the known bedding I had scouted so I went to an area that I didn't scout, I just guessed where some remote bedding might be and told myself I'd walk between these 2 bedding areas until I found a trail. It was just a guess on those two bedding areas. But sure enough I found 4 finger tracks on this buck trail on the side of the mountain. I immediately set up on that trail and right before dark one came in. However poor tree placement on my part...I couldn't get a shot till he got too close and then he winded me and my tracks on his trail and bailed. I was really proud of that hunt, completely went in blind. The bigger mountain ridges are tough nut to crack. I even see them bed on the windward facing slope, you'd think it wouldn't make sense for them to bed there based on looking at a map but the way the wind actually flows thru there is swirling all around.

[raisins]

I think a lot of the wind tunnel effect is due to suction caused by wind crossing over a ridge and resulting turbulence on the leeward side. Otherwise the effect would not strengthen with higher wind speeds.

I know when hunting the leeward side that the wind will gust and be unpredictable. It will flow the same direction as the dominant wind direction and then switch when speed picks up.

[cspot]

Here is one of Dan's videos that explains it with an animation. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7RF5QsFSd70

[BBH1980]

I just took a quick gander at your area in SE MN and looked at your hills, they're quite typical to what I hunt in PA and my general understanding of buck bedding. I see you have a well defined military crest on almost all of your slopes. That sharp crest drop off will allow for a strong "eddy" suction effect with the wind blowing over the ridge and the thermals rising. A sharp crest like that will make bedding more consistent. A gradual rolling crest will make bedding less consistent (elevation wise). When you're standing there midday you'll feel the wind seemingly blowing in opposite directions. That'll be ideal for buck bedding especially when they have some sort of thick cover (mostly to their back). When your ridge lines span with multiple points for bedding that would be ideal to sit that crest and expect deer travel. Or even a "Hub" where a large valley is surrounded by 2 or more converging ridges that type of terrain will swirl and create those eddy currents in all sorts of directions and create a safe haven for bucks.


In regards to buckthorn, I've read about it before but I don't worry about it. If its really bad in your area I would think that would actually be a benefit for you. Walk some of those ridges this spring and scout the bedding. As your walking I'm sure you'll find where the thorn is too thick to walk and where it does allow for travel. Should make for some nice pinch funnels for travel.

Not sure if i'm helping you?

I am hunting the hills of PA myself. I bought the DVDs and have been on the beast for around a year or so. Some of the hills I hunt are more like mountain terrain with several crests and benches on the way to the top. Climbing about 800-900 ft over 1/2 mile stretch. Lots of Laurel on top. My question is are these like the hills your hunting ? If so are you finding beds on the benches and each crest on the way up the hill or just on that top 1/3? These hills have several military crests to them. I have seen them bed on benches parralel to the hill wind to back but I am not sure if a mature buck would do that..

Each crest can have bedding from my own experience. In areas where the ridges are small its really easy to find, its just like Dan will tell you. In the bigger mountainous ridges though, start focusing on knobs, any crest not just the top crest, and sort of transition you can find is worth scouting. Even when your just scoutin, try to plan out your route b/c it'll wear you out so fast, haha.

I almost killed a very nice buck this year opening day in a mountainous setting. The wind wasn't what I had hoped for the known bedding I had scouted so I went to an area that I didn't scout, I just guessed where some remote bedding might be and told myself I'd walk between these 2 bedding areas until I found a trail. It was just a guess on those two bedding areas. But sure enough I found 4 finger tracks on this buck trail on the side of the mountain. I immediately set up on that trail and right before dark one came in. However poor tree placement on my part...I couldn't get a shot till he got too close and then he winded me and my tracks on his trail and bailed. I was really proud of that hunt, completely went in blind. The bigger mountain ridges are tough nut to crack. I even see them bed on the windward facing slope, you'd think it wouldn't make sense for them to bed there based on looking at a map but the way the wind actually flows thru there is swirling all around.

Thank you this answered my questions. Obviously I need to do the work scouting but I wanted to be sure I wasn't wasting my time checking all the crests and knobs. Sounds like you have a great hunt! I hope to get to that level someday!