Antler restrictions...opinions wanted...

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solocam88
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Re: Antler restrictions...opinions wanted...

Unread postby solocam88 » Fri Oct 08, 2010 10:42 am

AC Rider wrote:
solocam88 wrote:First and foremost I am sick and tired of the Do Nothing Right telling me what I can and cannot do while I am hunting.

Huh??? :? Are you talking the Political Right? If so, I'm not making the connection.

Anyway, I think a lot of the problem would be taken care of if they would move the gun season to the last week of November. This would save more bucks and allow them to grow older.


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Re: Antler restrictions...opinions wanted...

Unread postby AC Rider » Fri Oct 08, 2010 10:44 am

Sorry Solo - I'm not to quick today I guess.
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Re: Antler restrictions...opinions wanted...

Unread postby adrenalin » Fri Oct 08, 2010 11:04 am

You want to see more big bucks, then just give one buck tag for bow and one for gun. A buck tag has to be used on all bucks nubs, spikes, or full racks, no more 3 inches or less crap for an antlerless tag. Just think of all the nubbers shot each year as does.
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Re: Antler restrictions...opinions wanted...

Unread postby mcmidc » Fri Oct 08, 2010 12:51 pm

forgehunter wrote:
mcmidc wrote: What about areas where there are no doe tags? Now a guy can't fill his freezer because another want to hunt trophies? :roll:


The opnions on "the other website" are that, then you need to find another unit to hunt then... :roll:


Well then I guess my opinion differs from theirs. And I pass on small bucks. Antler restrictions aren't the way to go. They've had them in Michigan for many years now and look at all the booners falling every year :lol: . If these guys are really interested in more mature bucks then they should look more into a one buck rule(total for all weapons). But I still don't see why certain people think that they should be able to take "public" land (which belongs to all), and manage it the way a select few want it. Manage private land any way you want, but I think public should be left for the average guy to hunt what he wants.

This obsession with large antlers is going overboard. I like to shoot big bucks as much is the next guy, but I don't look down on any one for shooting whatever they are happy with. I've shot a 3.5 year old buck in the big woods that was an 8 pointer with a 13 inch spread, under these new rules I couldn't of even taken a mature deer? :roll:
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Re: Antler restrictions...opinions wanted...

Unread postby dan » Fri Oct 08, 2010 1:29 pm

Antler restrictions "could" be a good tool for Wisconsin. But I don't think the DNR who hates all trophy hunters would go for it... To there thinking trophy hunting is why there are to many deer in this state, and they also feel that trophy hunters are greedy and tie up all the land like in Buffalo county Wisconsin.
Antler restrictions would not work with spread or score. To easy to mess that up. It only works with point count. Say 4 points per side. And actually, it makes hunting much safer in the fact that a hunter can no longer legally shoot any deer he sees and now has to actually identify the deer before shooting.
One of the things that backfires with antler restrictions is it protects genetically inferior bucks and makes them the breeder bucks.
I filmed a mature buck in Rome marsh a few years ago that was only a 6 pointer. He would of made P&Y, and was mature, but would not be legal per a 4 point restriction and would be protected to do all the breeding.
I also seen a 20 inch wide massive 2X2 once that I still regret passing.
One thing that I have seen work well is a tactic used by the Illinois DNR
On a public parcel I hunted a few years ago...
In order to hunt the public property you had to meet with a DNR representative who went over the rules and explained what they were trying to manage the property for...
He showed me sheds that were picked up on the property and talked about the bucks age class and how to judge age class.
He said it is legal to shoot any deer you see, but we gave you a doe tag along with your choice tag. If your after meat please shoot a doe and let the bucks grow up. He said if a kid or new hunter wants to take a smaller deer, go ahead, but if you have some experience hunting please don't kill the immature bucks.
If you shot a deer, you would have to take it back to that same guy to register it for that property, and it would be pretty embarrassing if it was a little guy.
Needless to say, the property was loaded with deer and some big ones too. I only hunted a weekend and I almost got a Booner.

Once again, the problem with this type of management is that our Wisconsin DNR is totally against trophy type management.
In my opinion, there thinking is wrong. Any species being managed should be managed for a disbursed age range. Right now 90% of the bucks are 1 1/2 or younger due to this "poor" management.
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Re: Antler restrictions...opinions wanted...

Unread postby muddy » Fri Oct 08, 2010 2:17 pm

How many tags can u guys get up there?
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Re: Antler restrictions...opinions wanted...

Unread postby dan » Fri Oct 08, 2010 2:20 pm

muddy wrote:How many tags can u guys get up there?

Regular units allow one buck with bow, One with gun, but party hunting is legal so some gun hunters buy everybody they know a tag and shoot a lot of extra deer... CWD units like where I live have no limits and the tags are free.
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goldtip5575
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Re: Antler restrictions...opinions wanted...

Unread postby goldtip5575 » Fri Oct 08, 2010 2:40 pm

This would never work in WI because there are to many hunters and to many small blocks of land.These small blocks of land dont have the habitat to hold mature bucks if any deer at all.But do get deer pushed in or thru at times.But most of the time there does or small bucks.So now you want them not to shoot a 8 pt with a 13-14 spread or a fork when thats all they are probably going to see.I believe that the next year when that buck they didnt shoot meets shooter status hunter with better habitat land that shoots a trophy every year has a 90% chance of shooting that buck than those who passed the year b4.We all know these spots go shineing you see 1 here ,3 there,2 there,then boom 20 in one spot.People need to be able to shoot what makes THEM happy.
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Re: Antler restrictions...opinions wanted...

Unread postby Indianahunter » Fri Oct 08, 2010 2:54 pm

dan wrote:
muddy wrote:How many tags can u guys get up there?

Regular units allow one buck with bow, One with gun, but party hunting is legal so some gun hunters buy everybody they know a tag and shoot a lot of extra deer... CWD units like where I live have no limits and the tags are free.


That is stinking crazy DAN!

I am for antler restrictions, but against having them for children 18 and under.
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Re: Antler restrictions...opinions wanted...

Unread postby magicman54494 » Fri Oct 08, 2010 3:11 pm

I like the idea of antler restrictions.

In regards to youth hunters:
Allow them a choice their first year out.
After that they will most likely have the option of shooting does which should help keep their interest level up. Also, after the first year of restrictions, there should be many bucks that meet the restrictions.


Those who just want to shoot a deer:
If properly managed, does should always be available.
Again, after the first year of restrictions, there should be many bucks that meet the restrictions.

I agree with Dan that the best method of a balanced age class is thru education. I believe education along with antler restrictions to get things jump started is the answer. In a balanced age herd everybody wins.

Concerning the bucks that don't make restriction:
I believe these deer are rare and even where they exist they won't do all the breeding. Their genetics is already in the herd anyway (passed down from ma and pa) I also have read that the doe is just as important in regards to fawn buck antler genetics. I don't know if thats true or not. I'm not in favor of a spread restriction because it's just too hard to jugde in the field. Another possiblity is points OR spread. That way if a buck only has 6 points and you are sure that it has at least the min. spread you could still take that deer. There would be very few deer that wouldn't make restriction then. Eithor way we're talking about probably less than 1% of the population anyway. I don't think it makes sense to worry about 1% instead we should focus on the other 99%.

After a few years of restrictions I believe most hunters will enjoy seeing more mature bucks and would opt to pass small bucks even if there wasn't a law. I believe many hunters - especially public land hunters - shoot the first buck because they feel if they pass one they won't get another chance. AR would change this thought process. It's a lot easier to hold out for a nice buck when there's actually a few around. I also believe youth hunters will enjoy seeing more bucks because the 1-1/2 year olds will get a pass. Once AR has a few years to get going and with doe numbers in a huntable range probably less than 25% of the herd would be off limits. I believe AR is a good thing and all we have to do is invest a few years to reap the rewards.

Another positive about AR is that with a more balanced age class of bucks the genetically superior bucks would be doing more of the breeding - as nature intended.
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Re: Antler restrictions...opinions wanted...

Unread postby Hill Hunter » Sat Oct 09, 2010 1:58 am

Seems to work well for Missouri, I've hunted there a couple years and haven't seen a mature buck that would have been illegal to take based on their restrictions...
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Re: Antler restrictions...opinions wanted...

Unread postby Black Squirrel » Sat Oct 09, 2010 2:22 am

I am torn on this as well, I think some sort of plan to balance herd structure is good. We need more mature animals. Alot of farmland bucks are basket rack 8 points. Here you would still be killing alot of yearlings. I think there needs to be something in place to protect most yearlings. The huge problem with this is what?, and I don't have the answer. Not sure AR's are the way to go, but we have to start somewhere. I do like the one buck, regardless of weapon rule, that someone suggested, along with banning party hunting for bucks. Every year I hear of someone shooting 2 or sometimes 3 yearling bucks in a gun season!
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Re: Antler restrictions...opinions wanted...

Unread postby forgehunter » Sat Oct 09, 2010 3:12 am

Great thoughts on this everyone! keep it coming! I know there is more of you out there that have opinions on this subject...
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Re: Antler restrictions...opinions wanted...

Unread postby James » Sat Oct 09, 2010 3:17 am

Antler restrictions have affected me directly, so I can relay how it has been going so far here in MN. Last year I obtained access to a great farm in SE MN. I hunt the farm with a friend that I introduced to bowhunting last year. He is in his 30's and has never hunted in his life. Our goal was to get him ANY buck last year despite the property having great potential for mature bucks. He had an amazing rut with 3 or 4 shot opportunities on younger bucks and he did see a couple mature bucks but wasn't close enough for a shot. The year ended and he did not fill his tag but learned a ton.

This year MN imposed antler restrictions on all units in the 300 series. Our farm now falls into this category. Legal bucks must have at least 4 points on one side. (This has also made my father's hunting lease now an antler restriction zone and as a veteran hunter I think he has pretty excited about it). So last weekend we were hunting the SE MN farm for the first time in the year. My friend had 2 golden opportunities at a young 6 pointer and a fork (both 1.5 year olds). He had to let both of them walk and has still yet to shoot his first deer.

So for myself I am excited to know that most of the young deer will get to at least to that 2.5yo mark. However, knowing that new hunters to the sport such as my friend may hang up their bow in frustration gives pause for concern. He is actually in good spirits about it and knows that it will produce better hunting in the future, but he is also praying that a legal buck passes in front of his stand this fall.
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Re: Antler restrictions...opinions wanted...

Unread postby Schultzy » Sat Oct 09, 2010 10:47 am

I too would like to see something done here In Mn. I would rather see the Mn DNR move the gun season back 10 days and allot of our problems here where I hunt would be fixed. AR's would be ok to me too If they had no restrictions on hunters 60 and over and anyone under 18 years old.


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