Thwacking Doe's

[Indianahunter]

I had the privilege of sitting down with Larry Weishun a few years back and were talking about harvesting does and the importance of it. I know a lot of guys that won't shoot does and I thought maybe this information he had shared with me might be useful to some of you if you weren't already aware so here are a couple of reasons to harvest more does.
1. Bucks are very territorial during the rut, but outside of that, Does tend to be more territorial over local food sources. If you have a high doe to buck ratio and most properties do, does especially with young ones will actually push bucks to neighboring properties as they do not like to compete when they can have a low pressure food source nearby.

2. Larry said the ratio of buck to doe births in the midwest was about 1 buck to every 5 does born. A mature doe 3 years or older will give birth to twins or triplets each spring and the number of does on a particular property can rise very quickly in a matter of a few years.

3. The Rut. If you have a high concentration of Does, then bucks do not have to compete heavily for breading privileges nor do they have to travel far and wide (during daylight hours) to find a doe as they are abundant. He said on most properties he has manged where guys said they didn't notice much of a rut or felt they didn't have many bucks, he found that wasn't the case, and that most breeding was happening in the safety of night.

4. They are good eating and just plain fun to shoot.

I personally love to harvest does, I get almost as pumped as I do with a nice buck. So there is some land management tid bits for you. Hope it is helpful.

[Zap]

I like to shoot does also.

Dont care much for Larry, though.

marty

[solocam88]

I dont have anything against shooting does. I like shooting them and will usually take one a year for meat or because I have to for EAB. The doe population is way down in a lot of areas around by me due to EAB. One thing I cant stand is watching tv and listening to the "experts" preach about how it is so important to shoot does when they have never seen first hand how fast that will destroy a deer herd. If every hunter on the block in one of my areas shot as many does as some guys recommend you would be lucky to see a deer out their the next year. Some areas are capable of holding a lot of deer and some just cant. IMO people shouldnt base how many does they should shoot on what some "pro" says.

[Indianahunter]

Hey Zap, just out of curiosity why don't you like Larry. I don't know the man, just met him once, but was very nice and very approachable. I don't even think I have seen him hunt...lol.

[Indianahunter]

Hey solocam you may be right about that, I am sure it is probably area specific. We don't have EAB in Indiana, but I do know we have a ton of does. There are several counties here that are 8 doe counties. I often wondered after talking with Larry if things were different as he said he manages property in Texas but kept referring to the Mid-West. So who knows for sure.

[Zap]

Hey Zap, just out of curiosity why don't you like Larry. I don't know the man, just met him once, but was very nice and very approachable. I don't even think I have seen him hunt...lol.

Well all the "pro's" are going to be nice when you meet them, thats what they are paid to do.

I have not cared for alot of his "expert" statements that I have seen on shows.

Plus he aint a bowhunter.

I guess he just rubs me the wrong way.

As far as doe management, its going to be a different story wherever you go, some places there are too many, others not enough.

Where I hunt there are lots.
So if I "manage to get one" I have done my part.
Shot six last season. Let alot more walk.




Zap like's to eat venison, so do I.


marty

[Liberty-Hunt]

I agree with the fact of the different location situation.
It's the same for all animal species anyway.
There are so many factor that can influence the situation ;
land topographies, climate, weather, food availability & diversity, food competition with other species, predators concentration, human pressure, hunting pressure, disease, water quality, pollutions (natural & human)...
All of those points are changing all the time.

You should make work your good sense too...

[The Rav]

Last year I let a few does walk by hoping for a buck. I've decided that this year is going to be a "little bit" more about filling the freezer.

By the way Marty, your not really gonna put that ketchup on your venison are you? Try A-1 sometime, you'll never go back.

[dan]

I used to whack a lot of does... Now I cut way back because of population decline in my area... I miss shooting them, but with our Wisconsin DNR GIVING OUT UNLIMETED TAGS in the southern units we can't keep killing them.

[PredatorTC]

I shot them when i was younger but not anymore. Like Dan said, the population is low enough, i don't wanna take anymore out. Plus we butcher a cow every year and don't need the meat. I might shoot one for food when i move off to school. I did shoot one last year to practice self-filming which was successful.

[Mountain Man]

2. Larry said the ratio of buck to doe births in the midwest was about 1 buck to every 5 does born. A mature doe 3 years or older will give birth to twins or triplets each spring and the number of does on a particular property can rise very quickly in a matter of a few years.

Are you sure Larry really said this? I'm just asking b/c it is my understanding that doe and buck fawns are born at about a ratio of 1:1. If he did say that then IMO he's way off base.

The number of does to shoot in any area is going to vary greatly. I have to agree with the other WI guys that EAB has been overdone in a lot of the state. There are still a few pockets where killing some does every year won't affect the population in those areas, but again, in most deer management units in WI hunters do need to slow down or stop the doe killing for a while.

[tim]

i like shooting does, but honestly if im not getting lots of photos of does on my trail cams then i know my area isnt in need of killing them. one statement i would have to disagree with is that the ratio of does to bucks born. i have a hard time believing it is 5:1. i would say more like 1:1. its just that when nobody shoots does in certain areas i believe numbers end up that way. i own land in amish country and they are not shy on shooting does , so i usually dont shoot to many. i honestly can say most years i get as many or more pics of bucks from the time i put cams out till the time i pull them .

[Indianahunter]

I am 99.99999% sure that is what he said. Like I said, I don't know the guy, but when he was introduced his credential as a biologists seemed pretty impressive so I definitely hung on to whatever he said. Certainly you are the one in control of managing your herd, I just know we seem to have a lot of does and what he said made sense as we were having similar results on out property. After about four years of harvesting does, and passing on smaller bucks and then the implementation of the One Buck rule in Indiana we definitely started seeing more and nicer bucks and still plenty of does. I hope they never do an EAB if that is the result you all are having. YIKES!!!

[dan]

The 5 to 1 ratio comes as a surprise to me too... But Larry is a wildlife biologist specializing in whitetails.
I have heard that the number of buck fawns vs doe fawns changes percentage wise depending on herd density and food availability.

[muddy]

I like to shoot does also.

Dont care much for Larry, though.

marty

I agree 100% with that statement but it's all based on how many of his "hunts" are inside penned enclosures on TV.