Scouting flat farm land.....

[Z7WIBoy]

Great post - any chance ninja you could back the maps - it helps the new guys get a visual

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[Autumn Ninja]

Great post - any chance ninja you could back the maps - it helps the new guys get a visual

[ Post made via iPhone ]

Yes, I'll see if I can find them and get them posted back up in this thread.....If not I'll make new ones.

[Autumn Ninja]

Not sure if this fits the definition of a bump and dump...But here is another situation with the same food source and wind.

Note: These maps are fictitious, every situation is different...this is just an example.

I know a buck has been using bed A based on the wind and food scource....I cant find a good way to get on him in that location, his view is way to good and he's right on top of the food source. At 10-11 o'clock, after my morning hunt in a different location. I decide to try and stack a bed (using one of Andrae's terms)...so I make a pass by on his West side (because I wont him to go East)...I walk by and out of sight then double back the same way I went in (red). If he didn't bump when I went by the first time he will when he sees me coming back. Now I have a 1 in 3 chance that he will go to bed B and a 2 in 3 chance that he will go to beds C and D for the evening hunt.

Playing the odds, I now go in (green) and hunt beds C and D that evning...some place around the blue dot...depending on his view and staging off the bed. I'm hoping he will move a little earlier than he normally dose because he is a good distance from the food scorce...I also I have a real good idea of where he will be going when he leaves the bed (white oaks) where the prefered food is and ladies are hanging out, lol.

[Autumn Ninja]

I don't sneak but I don't want to sound like a dozer coming through the wood either, I just walk to my tree.

I will show an example in a map...If anyone wants to add to this they can. Tons of big bucks go down every year because of this exact situation...except there are two hunters and hunter A pushes the buck to hunter B by accident. Hunter B just happen to be at the right place at the right time.

Based on the wind direction (black) I know that the buck will be bedded in 1 of 4 locations (red). Based on the white oaks dropping (orange) right now...I can narrow it down to 1 bed. I will enter my tree passing by his bed from a safe distance below him (green) and continue to walk way out of sight...Then double back to my tree (blue), using the terrain to my advantage in several ways.



1. I use it to conceal my movement as I doubling back.
2. I set up on the edge so he cant get down wind of me when he moves by.
3. He will most likely wait until I'm long gone and the cost is clear. Then exit in the opposite direction I traveled and the terrain will force him by my stand.

[dan]

Ninja, great explanations!
We call it stacking rather than bump and dump... Your maps show it awesome!

[Black Squirrel]

Good Stuff Ninja, Thanks!

[dan]

Great posts Dan.

Can you give any other tips on very small pieces of farm country (public).

I know it is off topic but when are you planning to do your tree stand setup video?

Sorry Dan

Yes... Bucks tend to bed on the down wind side of a block of timber. They bed near the transition where they can see into the field and can smell anything from behind. Bucks that do this are very hard to kill cause they generally approach from the field (downwind) and j-hook into the bed watching there trail to the bed and smelling the woods behind them. If they feed into the down wind field they have been watching its really hard to be set up close enough without detection to kill them in daylight. This is the best scenario I know of for glassing. You watch the buck come and go from a distance ( observation stand or bino's from a truck) and form a game plan. If he is not getting across the field in daylight just give him time. Generally on a moon over head day, or a weather front day they get a little farther and not racing in but rather waiting for the right day seems to work best.

[gjs4]

Great post- number 9 is my bane ...we have tons of crp and dogwood and it is just too dang high and thick presnow...

[kenn1320]

Maybe it goes without saying, but you should be confident in the next days weather forcast to have high confidence the buck you bump will use that bed the next day. I haven't found beds in farm country that really appear to be on down wind side, but that's entirely possible. I've found beds on slight elevation changes that its clear they are facing into the woods with the ag field 40yds behind them thru thick/dense cover. This particular bed is on north end of a wood lot and bed is on south face of elevation change. No suprise hunters using this woodlot park at south end and walk north.

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[MOBIGBUCKS]

Great posts Dan.

Can you give any other tips on very small pieces of farm country (public).

I know it is off topic but when are you planning to do your tree stand setup video?

Sorry Dan

Yes... Bucks tend to bed on the down wind side of a block of timber. They bed near the transition where they can see into the field and can smell anything from behind. Bucks that do this are very hard to kill cause they generally approach from the field (downwind) and j-hook into the bed watching there trail to the bed and smelling the woods behind them. If they feed into the down wind field they have been watching its really hard to be set up close enough without detection to kill them in daylight. This is the best scenario I know of for glassing. You watch the buck come and go from a distance ( observation stand or bino's from a truck) and form a game plan. If he is not getting across the field in daylight just give him time. Generally on a moon over head day, or a weather front day they get a little farther and not racing in but rather waiting for the right day seems to work best.

I just bumped one the other day bedding like this Dan. A solid shooter for sure. I knew what he was doing as soon as I saw him jump up from the blowdown. The problem I have with this buck is the hunting pressure in the area...I don't think this buck is going out in the field until after dark. He may feed across the field but he is doing it after dark.

I think this particular buck has it figured out.

[kenn1320]

Maybe it goes without saying, but you should be confident in the next days weather forcast to have high confidence the buck you bump will use that bed the next day. I haven't found beds in farm country that really appear to be on down wind side, but that's entirely possible. I've found beds on slight elevation changes that its clear they are facing into the woods with the ag field 40yds behind them thru thick/dense cover. This particular bed is on north end of a wood lot and bed is on south face of elevation change. No suprise hunters using this woodlot park at south end and walk north.

[ Post made via iPhone ]

To add to my previous observation, I went to this same flat farmland yesterday. I was rabbit hunting and jumped a deer that appeared to be a doe. Upon inspecting her bed, she was on the upwind side of the woods and facing back into the woods with the open field/wind to her back. She had some back cover of brush(not much really), and 20yds towards the field was a dirt berm she wouldnt be able to see past. Her bed was on a slight angle to the wind and facing my dads house which was 150yds away. This deer like the buck bed above I mentioned beds with the wind/open field to their back and face the direction of typical human danger. I also found an interesting buck rub in the brush/tree's not far from the ditchline. No doubt there is a bed in there, will verify when the snow is gone. With a typical west wind, this bed is positioned so the only human traffic from the west would be directly upwind of this bed. Whats cool about this bed is the deer can watch the ditch, which is where my dad/brother tend to walk down to hunt the back of the woods. This deer has already patterned them and laughs as they walk past anywhere from 20yds to 50yds away. My dads property is a 1/4 mile x 1/4 mile square 40acres and its the whole wooded block and the adjoining property all around it is open field. These deer have learned the hunters, and adapted their bedding to take advantage of visual/sound alert more then scent. I dont think this is unique, since Dan and others have noted deer on public land bedding close to the parking with visual ability to see the hunters. Humans for the most part are the main predator in most areas and the deer are bedding to take advantage of that. I walked back to a big hinge cutting and in the past deer were up under this big canopy during the winter. It was like a big brush pile for rabbits and full of deer crap when I shed hunted in there a few years ago. This year, nothing in it, only around it. I think it has settled to much and the deer feel trapped under it, since only one side is open for them to get under it. More chainsaw work is needed to make it "active" again. The open side is the west side, which is our predominate wind, yet they are not bedding on that side with this thick almost impenatrable cover at their backs. This confirms again on this land, the deer favor visual danger alerts over scent. Danger approaching this big cutting comes from East or South, never West or North since we dont own the fields on those sides. Deer are bedding on the south and east sides to use their vision to detect hunters. This woods is undergoing a lot of change, all the large Ash trees have been removed and the tops left. This woods is no longer your typical see 100yds in any direction when the leaves are down type woods. I suspect the deer may start to resort to scent more then visual, similar to how they do in thick areas like marsh. Funny I found a buck bed a couple springs ago not 15yds from my dads gun shack. The deer was positioned to see the ditch and likely watched him approach and skirted out before he got there. When I showed my dad, he just laughed like he couldnt believe it.

[Lockdown]

Bump. I live in farmland and have hunted it all my life. So far I have found the slews and swamps are consistent with the Marsh Bucks way of thinking and bedding. The comments made about riverbottoms are accurate as well... mainly buck beds on oxbows. One thing I want to talk about, and its mentioned in this thread, is how deer bed in flat, regular groves.

I have a couple really nice groves to hunt that would otherwise be nothing, minus the fact they are located in great areas with good habitat. Most of my success in these groves is during rut, but I have noticed some bedding tendencies.

When Dan says the deer will bed on the down wind side, he is right. I have found this to be true with bucks... not does... the does have their spots they like to lay and they lay there regardless. I'd like to pick apart what Dan is saying and share with you what I've found when hunting farm country and groves for 20 years.

From my experiences, the bucks are EXTREMELY hard to pin point in farm country. By the way, this is my 2nd year of hunting beds, so what I'm sharing with you is coming from experiences without beast knowledge... not what I've seen thru my scouting. I agree with Dan when he says they bed on the down wind sides of groves. However, don't take that to an extreme. I'll show you a perfect example of a mature buck bedding where you wouldn't expect him, wind wise.

Yellow is stand placement and approach. Red is bedded buck.



The only reason I knew this buck bedded here, is because when I got strait north of him, I looked thru a small opening in the buckthorn and saw him laying 20 yards away, eyes closed, head bobbing up and down, SLEEPING. It was very windy that day, and I entered on a wheel track in chisel plowed beans. I ALWAYS sneak, no matter what the situation is. That is why he never heard me. The green is his view from his bed. There is a lot of activity that goes on NW of him (hence my stand location). There are multiple deer trails, scrapes, and a 4 wheeler trail they use to head North and South thru the grove. He can smell the activity, and see approaching danger. The only reason he didn't see me when I was strait East of him, is because he was sleeping.

Is this a "classic" buck bedding location? No not really... but I can see why he laid there.

He was laying down facing me, so I snuck back along the east side to try and get a broadside shot. It was too thick. My next plan was to go back to the original opening (which was a deer trail) and try to hide out until he stood up. Part way back I noticed his head was up, but he still wasn't aware of my presence, even though I was MAYBE 20 yards away. My only choice was to keep going as slowly as possible. When I got to where I wanted to be, he was gone. To this day I don't know if he saw me and snuck off or moved away naturally.

Moral of the story is he was on the down wind side of the grove, but not where I expected him. This is an inhabited grove, so maybe the human activity near the house forced him to bed north farther than he would have otherwise.

[Lockdown]

If anyone is interested in seeing more set ups and experiences like this, I have a bunch of them I can show. IMO farm country is the hardest to hunt and doesn't get talked about as much as swamp and hill, so I'd be glad to share more... just let me know.

On a side note I killed that buck a couple weeks later on the south end of the grove using a decoy. He was bedded on the South end with the does, 3 days in a row, all with a SE wind. Got lucky

[justin84]

Thanks for sharing Lockdown. I'd be interested in seeing more. I only have access to one spot in farm country, and I've had a hard time with it.

[kenn1320]

If anyone is interested in seeing more set ups and experiences like this, I have a bunch of them I can show. IMO farm country is the hardest to hunt and doesn't get talked about as much as swamp and hill, so I'd be glad to share more... just let me know.

On a side note I killed that buck a couple weeks later on the south end of the grove using a decoy. He was bedded on the South end with the does, 3 days in a row, all with a SE wind. Got lucky

Lockdown, according to your aerial picture, that buck is bedded on the upwind side of the grove. Down wind side would be bottom right hand corner. What you experienced is exactly what I see in flat farm land. Your buck is bedded with open field wind to his back and viewing the farm house for danger. The only thing I have seen slightly different is the buck could also bed on the upper left corner with that same wind. Its my opinion this buck does not experience much if any danger from the back side of that grove, but rather up the farm house side which happens to be the side you use to access your stand in this photo. Your observation confirms my believe, the deer in those situations face the danger for visual and "smell" the open field behind them.