Understanding this "Night" Bed and Saddle Area

[KLEMZ]

I noticed a lot of the pic's were in the morning of the buck standing in / at the bed... Tracking whitetails in snow has taught me that they often "smell check" several beds before finally choosing one within a certain bedding area. Some bucks I tracked went to 5 or 6 known beds before finally laying down. Good chance there is daytime bedding real close to that spot.

This is consistent with what I have observed as well. One additional wrinkle is that I have seen their tracks walk through some known beds in one bedding spot that is not being currently bedded in, yet they are currently bedding 200 yards away in another bedding complex. Why are they walking through actual beds that won't be used for months? It is a consistent pattern that I am seeing. Are they just double checking that it is still a secure area for when they do need it? I don't know. But it does give me extra confidence that it is a preferred secure spot for them.

[rfickes87]

I noticed a lot of the pic's were in the morning of the buck standing in / at the bed... Tracking whitetails in snow has taught me that they often "smell check" several beds before finally choosing one within a certain bedding area. Some bucks I tracked went to 5 or 6 known beds before finally laying down. Good chance there is daytime bedding real close to that spot.

This is consistent with what I have observed as well. One additional wrinkle is that I have seen their tracks walk through some known beds in one bedding spot that is not being currently bedded in, yet they are currently bedding 200 yards away in another bedding complex. Why are they walking through actual beds that won't be used for months? It is a consistent pattern that I am seeing. Are they just double checking that it is still a secure area for when they do need it? I don't know. But it does give me extra confidence that it is a preferred secure spot for them.

I first noticed this spot while walking the field transition and seeing the brush trampled over and chewed up. Its right where the ridge gets low in elevation and saddles. I turned and walked inside the wood line and immediately saw the bed. Its apparently a "night" bed but he uses this in daylight to enter/exit the field to feed and sometimes during daylight or go freshen a scrape on those rainy days . Other bucks are passing thru here also, but usually after dark.

Dan, question for you... I read somewhere before where you said about deer bedding at night to chew their cud. Perhaps that is all this bed is used for? For him to feed in that field and then go bed there afterwards and chew? You also mentioned up above about there is probably a primary day-time bed near by. I had always thought this too but would you consider 1/4 mile nearby? Reason I ask is that, I've searched all along this 1/3 elevation. I've found more beds like this one right next to the field on this elevation but they don't strike me as primary daytime beds. So I haven't put much regard into them. Now, half way down the hill is an old logging road. He's hit those scrapes often in October usually about an hour after dark. And actually he seems to approached them always from downhill or walking on/with the road. Also if I walk clear to the bottom of the ridge, cross the creek and go up the next ridge about 1/4 mile away there is another logging road half way up that hillside and he's on camera last October working those scrapes too. Again an hour after daylight and again approaching from down hill.

My latest theory is his primary bed could be much lower in elevation than I've been focusing my time on when scouting. I've been down to that creek once and its super thick and littered with tracks. Experience has taught me not to put much stock into those muddy creek tracks because they look fresh but actually probably aren't. But in this case I just wonder if he is bedded down in there. Topos show so low elevation points just up from that creek. I need to get back out and check them out again... My goal obviously is to find the primary bed. I just think maybe it's not on the upper 1/3, but actually the lower third?

[dan]

Your assumptions might be right... You also might be looking for a primary bed and there might not be one. It might be that he floats around to a lot of beds in that area based on the exact wind and thermal activity. Which could be why he is on film possibly checking beds. Night beds are often just like the one you showed... Near food. Not in a great location for day protection. But sometimes you get both uses out of it...

[rfickes87]

Your assumptions might be right... You also might be looking for a primary bed and there might not be one. It might be that he floats around to a lot of beds in that area based on the exact wind and thermal activity. Which could be why he is on film possibly checking beds. Night beds are often just like the one you showed... Near food. Not in a great location for day protection. But sometimes you get both uses out of it...

Thanks Dan.

Yeah in those night bed pictures the wind was perfectly leeward. And that random picture I got of him on the next ridge over working a scrape, I check that wind and sure enough it was a leeward wind for that ridge as well. So he's definitely floating around like you said on those ridges hitting up the areas with leeward wind. I just continue to believe he's bedded during the day somewhere much lower in elevation, and somewhere still leeward. Also all the parking lots are up high on ridges and everyone seems to hunt up high. No one wants to walk 3/4 mile down to the bottom of the ridges so he's avoiding that pressure.

[dan]

Probably gotta figure out the area he is bedding in rather than the spot, and set up where he exits the area. There are plenty of times / spots where I know a big buck is bedding but you can't find the exact spots.

[Boogieman1]

How u go about checking cameras placed directly infront of beds?

[dan]

How u go about checking cameras placed directly infront of beds?

They sit there for a loooong time before checking, or use cell cams.

[Mario]

Funny you guys are reading this post because for the first time since January, I went and scouted this area again over the weekend. I had a couple cameras on beds to retrieve. With my fiancé sitting in the car waiting on me and the temp at about 95 degrees I was in and out of the woods very quickly. But I did try to speed scout back thru this area. Real close to where this bed was, is a new beaten down trail I hadn't notice all last year. This trail runs from the field on top the ridge perpendicular straight down the hillside thru the woods, I followed it briefly straight down and then noticed it started to Y into multiple directions so I stopped there and headed back. If my phone wasn't dead Id post a picture of a huge track I found on the trail. Probably the biggest track I've ever seen personally. Easily fit 4 fingers.

Nothing on my cameras, But a theory I concluded from seeing that trail is that same buck may still alive and be a 5.5 year old now. Perhaps he moved his bed lower down in that hillside somewhere or even the next ridge over as he didn't show up on my cameras. And he's is coming up on that trail to feed at night. So obviously I'll be heading back to try and figure this out! This area is just so tough. I was only out for an hour. All cut up from the briers. Soaked in sweat. Brutal!

Maybe unrelated but something that sticks out in my mind after watching the Hill Country bedding DVD is JoeRE describe a centralized or thermal pooling area which was adjacent to hill bedding.

I realize the bed location is somewhat opposite of what he was describing since if I understand this correctly the buck is bedded down low from the field. But could the buck or bucks prefer this bedding or staging area because thermals from the field pool here? or pull down the hill in the evening so the buck or bucks can scent check the field before entering?

[Boogieman1]

They sit there for a loooong time before checking, or use cell cams.

Gotcha thanx... Might do a lil experiment this season and put out a small handful of cams on beds and let em soak all season. Like to see what kind of intell and tendencies they might reveal. Most of my bedding is exactly what u mentioned above, numerous beds within the same bedding density. The only permanent beds I have ever came across, at first look had me scratching my head but after dropping some milkweed Ah Haa! Savy suckers. These permanent beds I came across all had some type of drainage in common which they will often follow to the fields below.

[rfickes87]

How u go about checking cameras placed directly infront of beds?

Unfortunately I don't think I get enough service to use a cell cam. Can't really afford it either. I just run regular cheap cams. I left this camera there for 2 months. And I ignored the results for the first 2 weeks because of my scent in there. I just picked some up I left out for 5 months.

[rfickes87]

How u go about checking cameras placed directly infront of beds?

Unfortunately I don't think I get enough service to use a cell cam. Can't really afford it either. I just run regular cheap cams. I left this camera there for 2 months. And I ignored the results for the first 2 weeks because of my scent in there. I just picked some up I left out for 5 months.

[rfickes87]

Funny you guys are reading this post because for the first time since January, I went and scouted this area again over the weekend. I had a couple cameras on beds to retrieve. With my fiancé sitting in the car waiting on me and the temp at about 95 degrees I was in and out of the woods very quickly. But I did try to speed scout back thru this area. Real close to where this bed was, is a new beaten down trail I hadn't notice all last year. This trail runs from the field on top the ridge perpendicular straight down the hillside thru the woods, I followed it briefly straight down and then noticed it started to Y into multiple directions so I stopped there and headed back. If my phone wasn't dead Id post a picture of a huge track I found on the trail. Probably the biggest track I've ever seen personally. Easily fit 4 fingers.

Nothing on my cameras, But a theory I concluded from seeing that trail is that same buck may still alive and be a 5.5 year old now. Perhaps he moved his bed lower down in that hillside somewhere or even the next ridge over as he didn't show up on my cameras. And he's is coming up on that trail to feed at night. So obviously I'll be heading back to try and figure this out! This area is just so tough. I was only out for an hour. All cut up from the briers. Soaked in sweat. Brutal!

Maybe unrelated but something that sticks out in my mind after watching the Hill Country bedding DVD is JoeRE describe a centralized or thermal pooling area which was adjacent to hill bedding.

I realize the bed location is somewhat opposite of what he was describing since if I understand this correctly the buck is bedded down low from the field. But could the buck or bucks prefer this bedding or staging area because thermals from the field pool here? or pull down the hill in the evening so the buck or bucks can scent check the field before entering?

HAHA Mario funny you mention that... Last evening I received my Hill DVD and watched it for the first time. I paid close attention to JoeRE's segment because that really hit home for me and my situation with this buck. I was thinking the same thing last night as you just stated. The land features are a lot alike but the hollow that forms the hub is probably twice as big as JoeRe's topo showed. Very similar though! Access to the hub for other hunters would be very difficult and I think he's "primarily" bedded down in the hub and not up on the leeward 1/3 ridge that I've scouted already.

[KLEMZ]

Maybe unrelated but something that sticks out in my mind after watching the Hill Country bedding DVD is JoeRE describe a centralized or thermal pooling area which was adjacent to hill bedding.

I have not seen the new Hill Country DVD yet so I don't know exactly what Joe was talking about, but I have found big buck bedding spots in low thermal pooling areas near hill bedding. Just this April, in a north country big woods setting, I found multiple bedding sites on a series of gentle points (15-20 feet elevation) that covered all winds except South as far as I could tell. This was typical hill bedding, just small hills. However, the heaviest used bedding area was NOT on the hill points, but rather at the base of the hills (down in the low terrain directly adjacent to the points).

I found big tracks, droppings etc. on the hill beds, but the beds where definitely spread out in their use by the big buck because none of them were obviously heavy used. Quite by accident I walked down to the lower elevation near the hills and came across an odd open area in an otherwise brushy landscape. This open area was a 4 yards by 6 yards oval and was completely matted down as any well used bed would be. I found white belly hairs throughout the entire oval. I found huge tracks and huge droppings as well as average sized. The most unique thing I noticed was that this spot was at the absolute LOWEST point in this area. It was a gentle uphill slope in ALL directions for at least 100 yards from the bed (matted area). And it was within 100 yards of the nearest hill point beds that I found.

So why are the deer (including a fully mature buck) spending so much time here?

-do they hang here because it is the only non brushy pocket around, or is it the only non brushy pocket because deer lay here all the time?

-do they hang here only on south winds because there are not any points nearby that accomodate south wind bedding?

-are they only staging here in the evenings to get the pooling thermals from all directions before they head out?

-are they only bedding here on south winds? Do they only bed here during hot weather (South wind usually) because cooler air settles to the lowest elevation?

I don't know any of the reasons why, but I would welcome any Beast insights! I can't help but think this bed is related somehow to rfickes87's saddle bed.

I did set a tail cam up to watch this spot. I plan to leave it till November, hopefully it will shed some insights.

[rfickes87]

Maybe unrelated but something that sticks out in my mind after watching the Hill Country bedding DVD is JoeRE describe a centralized or thermal pooling area which was adjacent to hill bedding.

I have not seen the new Hill Country DVD yet so I don't know exactly what Joe was talking about, but I have found big buck bedding spots in low thermal pooling areas near hill bedding. Just this April, in a north country big woods setting, I found multiple bedding sites on a series of gentle points (15-20 feet elevation) that covered all winds except South as far as I could tell. This was typical hill bedding, just small hills. However, the heaviest used bedding area was NOT on the hill points, but rather at the base of the hills (down in the low terrain directly adjacent to the points).

I found big tracks, droppings etc. on the hill beds, but the beds where definitely spread out in their use by the big buck because none of them were obviously heavy used. Quite by accident I walked down to the lower elevation near the hills and came across an odd open area in an otherwise brushy landscape. This open area was a 4 yards by 6 yards oval and was completely matted down as any well used bed would be. I found white belly hairs throughout the entire oval. I found huge tracks and huge droppings as well as average sized. The most unique thing I noticed was that this spot was at the absolute LOWEST point in this area. It was a gentle uphill slope in ALL directions for at least 100 yards from the bed (matted area). And it was within 100 yards of the nearest hill point beds that I found.

So why are the deer (including a fully mature buck) spending so much time here?

-do they hang here because it is the only non brushy pocket around, or is it the only non brushy pocket because deer lay here all the time?

-do they hang here only on south winds because there are not any points nearby that accomodate south wind bedding?

-are they only staging here in the evenings to get the pooling thermals from all directions before they head out?

-are they only bedding here on south winds? Do they only bed here during hot weather (South wind usually) because cooler air settles to the lowest elevation?

I don't know any of the reasons why, but I would welcome any Beast insights! I can't help but think this bed is related somehow to rfickes87's saddle bed.

I did set a tail cam up to watch this spot. I plan to leave it till November, hopefully it will shed some insights.

KLEMZ, I wish I could answer your questions but I can't. Nice work hanging that trail camera though. I'd recommend that and then go back to weatherunderground.com and check the weather history for each day. You'll hopefully learn a lot from that and can use that intel for early season next year.

[rfickes87]

I'd like to keep discussing this. Dan and others thank you for your ongoing feedback! I took the time to draw up a map of what this area looks like. This sketch represents about 700-800 acres. From peak of ridge to ridge is a half mile. I'm starting to define the center of this area as a "Thermal Hub" as JoeRE stated in the hill DVD and I've see topos from Autumn ninja mentioning a thermal hub. Tell me if I'm wrong though, I do wonder if perhaps this area is too large to work as a hub?


Hunting access is only from the peak elevations. Last summer I parked near the peak of RIDGE #1 and walked the leeward green brier edge just above the military crest in BLACK LINES. I found these beds by walking the access route in (PURPLE) and also tried hunting 3 times last season using that same access and setting up on that PURPLE dot to hunt over the bed. Perhaps I hunted it wrong but really I'm just to understand this area and learn why this spot attracts so many bucks. BROWN lines are logging roads. RED DOTS are scrapes I've found. Note: All bucks I have on camera approach these scrapes either from downhill in elevation or by walking on the road. I've confirmed already that scrapes and bedding on Ridge #1 are only hit on WSW, SW winds. Scrapes on Ridge 3 were hit on E/NE winds, obviously for that leeward effect.

GREEN OUTLINES = overgrown thick green brier fields.

BLACK DOTS = known night beds.

The BLUE triangle simply represents the field of view of my camera and the pictures I'm sharing with you (with the night bed in the center. Notice how all the bucks walk past it from near left to far right... They are walking that military crest along the ridge until they get to the saddle and then they're entering/exiting that field. My assumption is the pulling thermals in this low level area make them feel safe to enter.

The BROWN DOTTED trail is something new I just found when checking cameras recently. 1 foot wide trail completely trampled down with 4 finger tracks in it.



Here's 2 other bucks I forgot to post before. But it just goes to show the pattern here with this saddle and how these bucks travel. They must really like how this wind flows thru this area, anyone of those bucks was there always on a SW wind. But furthermore I guess this heavy travel all in relation to the wind advantage they have here of getting pulling air currents from multiple directions through the saddle? Probably why it was a good spot to bed at night. Air sinking and funneling thru here from all over that ridge.

My same buck leaving his bed...


a random 7...



random 10...






Getting back to a bedding locations... Its obvious what I found was just a night bed on that top 1/3 elevation. The most remote access would be down in the bottom of this area. This is something that's been difficult to scout. Its all hardwoods but still littered with briers everywhere. And very hard to get through. I suspect I may find primary bedding at the bottom of ridge #2. That is my next task and would make a lot of sense to be in the center location in that hub. with access to food, water and the same buck working scrapes on ridges 1 and 3.