whitetail hunting season

[kenn1320]

Makes absolutley no sense!!! We need to get real hunters that can make good decisions for our hunting seasons and deer. Rather than these pencil pushers where do they come up with this stuff.

Michigans has lots of problems, unfortunately most of them are the hunters themselves. Give them a rope and they would hang themselves. Same way with tags, they shoot every deer they see, then blame the DNR when there are no deer in their area. Search the forums on other sites and you will see Im not joking. Guys who say they sat all season and only seen a 4pnt, and you guessed it, they shot it. Sorry, if Im not seeing deer, I find a new spot. If I was stuck in a certain area, Im not going to shoot the only deer I see. I have been passing bucks in Mi since 2001. I see plenty of 1.5yr olds, but my neighbors do their part to ensure they dont get to be 2.5yr olds. Also the thing to remember the MI DNR is not managing for quality, but rather quantity. Until that strategy is changed, we are stuck with the same old same old. I know a lot of people dont want anything to do with QDM, but honestly they are the best thing going if we want to see change! The MI DNR has acknowledged QDM publicly and supports their efforts. I suggest if you want change, support QDM.

[DEERSLAYER]

...Last year a would be new bow state record was poached right before the end of the year. So they are here despite all of the hunting pressure...

I don't think I heard about that one. How big was it? There are decent numbers of nice bucks in southern Michigan because of the limited access and good nutrition.

...Even if the hunter is tagged out i guarentee his aunt or his wife who probably never sits foot in the woods but can still buy a license, is getting a couple buck also...

Definitely A LOT of that going on.

Good luck to you too BCam.

Michigans has lots of problems, unfortunately most of them are the hunters themselves. Give them a rope and they would hang themselves...

Yup, that's us.

[BCam]

...Last year a would be new bow state record was poached right before the end of the year. So they are here despite all of the hunting pressure...

I don't think I heard about that one. How big was it? There are decent numbers of nice bucks in southern Michigan because of the limited access and good nutrition.

...Even if the hunter is tagged out i guarentee his aunt or his wife who probably never sits foot in the woods but can still buy a license, is getting a couple buck also...

Definitely A LOT of that going on.

Good luck to you too BCam.

Michigans has lots of problems, unfortunately most of them are the hunters themselves. Give them a rope and they would hang themselves...

Yup, that's us.

It green scored over 190 typical. I know the dnr is still carrying around the rack and using it as and emample at hunters safety classes.

[Uncle Lou]

People hunt for different reasons, not all are chasing big horns. I dont think the state is supposed to help grow bigger horns. They have their hands full just managing the herd size.

Because of the deer hunting culture and tradition I don't think changing the date would happen. But to help grow bigger bucks, proposing one buck every other year and two bucks the off years might get some traction. Plus it is very uncomplicated not like most proposals.

[ Post made via Android ]

[rack addict]

Glad to see all the input on this thread. Everyone brings up great points and I can understand where everyone is coming from. I really think if they would go to 1 buck and it has to be say 3 points or more on one side and atleast shorten up the gun and muzzleloader season we would see a descent improvement. The poaching is crazy and i just cant understand the thrill in it. I can understand it would be a tough sell with the economy the way it is if there was a spike in front of me and it meant my family ate or not he would be dead.

GOOD LUCK TO EVERYONE THIS SEASON!!!

[Tadmdad]

I know a lot of people dont want anything to do with QDM, but honestly they are the best thing going if we want to see change! The MI DNR has acknowledged QDM publicly and supports their efforts. I suggest if you want change, support QDM.

Honestly, understand all of the QDM montra, have read alot of their literature.
Then went to a couple of local chapters meetings, walked away shaking my head. My take...a bunch of guys with antler addiction and land management focus on growing bigger bucks.

If change is what is needed here in MI, then recoginize that change is internal and not a external issue, and happens one person at a time. Become part of the process, go to DNR meetings, become active in the process. Take a young hunter hunting and teach them, they are the future and the vehicle for change. Everytime I take a young person afield, I'm amazed at their grasp of the issues that affect our sport, and have very positive outlook for the future.

Have lived in MI most of my life, this is a great place to live. And with all the lakes and public land, a great place to be a sportsperson. So if we don't have the best deer hunting...so what...change it....if it's what we want. Personally I don't deer hunt in MI anylonger, guess thats why I'm on the computer the 2nd morning of bow season.

[Tadmdad]

People hunt for different reasons, not all are chasing big horns. I dont think the state is supposed to help grow bigger horns. They have their hands full just managing the herd size.

[ Post made via Android ]

Amen Uncle Lou...couldn't agree more.

[Indianahunter]

1 Buck per year would fix the states problems. But it would be a hard sell to the weekend warriors set in there ways...

We have been a 1 buck state for about 8 years I believe and I can tell you it has made a significant difference. However we have the most liberal gun season in the nation. The DNR proposed changing the gun season to start the Saturday before Thanksgiving and I was pumped about it, but there was such an outrage that they dropped it and it resumes being the second Saturday in November. I hate it. I don't want to take anything away from people who prefer or are only able to hunt with a gun, but they have 9+ weeks of nearly uninterrupted gun season every year.

[kenn1320]

People hunt for different reasons, not all are chasing big horns. I dont think the state is supposed to help grow bigger horns. They have their hands full just managing the herd size.

I agree with ya Lou, just would be nice if the herd was managed to include a good mixture of all age classes, so those that want big antlers can eat some of the cake.

Honestly, understand all of the QDM montra, have read alot of their literature.
Then went to a couple of local chapters meetings, walked away shaking my head. My take...a bunch of guys with antler addiction and land management focus on growing bigger bucks.

Ouch Tadmdad. Hey I but heads with some guys in my local chapter about the numbers of does they propose to shoot. Lucky for "us in that area" the president had a good understanding of things and backed me up several times on my opinion. I would still suggest ya get involved with that Chapter and it could be YOU that puts a positive spin on that whole group. Going to the DNR is just another hunter complaining in my opinion, where as most QDM guys are like minded and there is power in numbers. Now about your statement, I enjoy manipulating the land for better hunting, and improving the habitat for all animals. I have no problem passing up young bucks in hopes of someday getting a shot at a mature deer. I realize the need to keep the population in check, so they don't over browse the area. Guess by definition I am what you experienced at the local chapter, but don't see that as a bad thing???

I only push rope so much each year, the rest of the time I'm hunting out of state as well.

[Indianahunter]

I know a lot of people dont want anything to do with QDM, but honestly they are the best thing going if we want to see change! The MI DNR has acknowledged QDM publicly and supports their efforts. I suggest if you want change, support QDM.

Honestly, understand all of the QDM montra, have read alot of their literature.
Then went to a couple of local chapters meetings, walked away shaking my head. My take...a bunch of guys with antler addiction and land management focus on growing bigger bucks.

If change is what is needed here in MI, then recoginize that change is internal and not a external issue, and happens one person at a time. Become part of the process, go to DNR meetings, become active in the process. Take a young hunter hunting and teach them, they are the future and the vehicle for change. Everytime I take a young person afield, I'm amazed at their grasp of the issues that affect our sport, and have very positive outlook for the future.

Have lived in MI most of my life, this is a great place to live. And with all the lakes and public land, a great place to be a sportsperson. So if we don't have the best deer hunting...so what...change it....if it's what we want. Personally I don't deer hunt in MI anylonger, guess thats why I'm on the computer the 2nd morning of bow season.

It can't be all about the racks and I am actually not a QDM fan because they are breeding a generation that knows nothing about true outdoor sportsmanship and skill, just Big Antler farming. I like big bucks as much as the next guy but I think that is a personal management decision as you stated. You are the one with the finger on the trigger so I guess ultimately you have the authority about the age structure and herd ratios.
I also agree that the DNR has their hands full with trying to manage herd numbers. However at least in my neck of the woods the biggest problem with assisting the DNR with management especially in high population areas is the lack of access. I think it would be wise for the DNR to offer incentives to land owners to allow hunting by tax breaks or by state leasing of private property as they do in Kansas. Kansas is the benchmark for intelligent wildlife management by the government.

[kenn1320]

they are breeding a generation that knows nothing about true outdoor sportsmanship and skill, just Big Antler farming.

Seriously? I could see your point if they were promoting high fence hunting, but they are not. States that have great hunting dont need as much help, hence the reason MI has been the highest growth for QDM.

I like big bucks as much as the next guy but I think that is a personal management decision as you stated. You are the one with the finger on the trigger so I guess ultimately you have the authority about the age structure and herd ratios.

That's what I have said all along, till those deer leave your property and
Without the help from the state, change will only come from like minded individuals (neighbors), agreeing on some level. Where QDM co-ops have formed, change is evident.

I think it would be wise for the DNR to offer incentives to land owners to allow hunting by tax breaks or by state leasing of private property as they do in Kansas.

Michigan has done this for as long as I can remember. With out different laws and the number of hunters we have, combined with mainly small acreage ownership, these public access spots are generally "shot out".

I often wonder who is truly obsessed with antlers? Is it the guy who can go years passing little bucks in hopes for a big one, or the guy who cant let any antlered buck go without shooting it? "I got my buck",,,,,Pure Michigan.

[Bucky]

I often wonder who is truly obsessed with antlers? Is it the guy who can go years passing little bucks in hopes for a big one, or the guy who cant let any antlered buck go without shooting it? "I got my buck",,,,,Pure Michigan.

[Indianahunter]

they are breeding a generation that knows nothing about true outdoor sportsmanship and skill, just Big Antler farming.

Seriously? I could see your point if they were promoting high fence hunting, but they are not. States that have great hunting dont need as much help, hence the reason MI has been the highest growth for QDM.

Let me qualify this statement as I can see your point. Almost everyone that I know that practices "QDM" are not members of the QDMA. From the outside looking in the QDMA looks like it is simply the promotion of farming for big deer ( I understand it is more). So most guys read an article or two, plant plots, put out minerals, and shoot every doe that comes in to sight without an honest evaluation of the whole herd health. We have Rural King, Tractor Supply, and Wal-Mart locally as well as a grain place that has entire areas dedicated to plot seed, minerals and attractants. They sell out of this stuff every year and the guys that I talk to at the local archery shop are buying all this stuff and doing all these things hoping to get bigger bucks but never scoring. The thing that always gets me is when I talk to these guys they primarily or only sit at the edge of their plots and don't know anything about their property and are missing tremendous opportunities. The few guys that I have reviewed aerials and topo's with are always amazed at awesome areas they didn't realize were good spots on their property. I put this (17yr old kid) guy in a classic funnel during the 1st week of November last year and downwind of what I thought was a pretty likely place for some kind of bedding. He ended up killing a buck that he had pics of on his plots but never seen the deer in person. He was a small 123" deer but This kid was pumped. When he called me to come out there and help him get his deer we looked at the ridge where I suspected bedding and it was a doe bedding area. He had been sitting at the edge of his plot all season up to that point and had stands pre-set on all sides for different winds.
I am not against good management practices, I am against people looking from the outside in and their only motivation is big racks and that has been the primary advertising and draw to management practices that are published outside of the QDMA, but if you are not on the inside of the organization this is what people think it is about. I would like to see hunters become better hunters, and people motivated by the adventure of the hunt not simply the racks. I am certain it is not the QDMA's intention to diminish anything from the outdoor sport of deer hunting.
I am very passionate about preserving and protecting our outdoor heritage so I have made it a personal goal of mine to promote good ethics, technical education, and seeking the adventure of the hunt for the best bucks on your property. Like I said I love shooting big bucks, but I fear this may become all the sport is about because that is what it is to the newer generation.

[kenn1320]

Let me qualify this statement as I can see your point. Almost everyone that I know that practices "QDM" are not members of the QDMA. From the outside looking in the QDMA looks like it is simply the promotion of farming for big deer ( I understand it is more). So most guys read an article or two, plant plots, put out minerals, and shoot every doe that comes in to sight without an honest evaluation of the whole herd health. We have Rural King, Tractor Supply, and Wal-Mart locally as well as a grain place that has entire areas dedicated to plot seed, minerals and attractants. They sell out of this stuff every year and the guys that I talk to at the local archery shop are buying all this stuff and doing all these things hoping to get bigger bucks but never scoring. The thing that always gets me is when I talk to these guys they primarily or only sit at the edge of their plots and don't know anything about their property and are missing tremendous opportunities. The few guys that I have reviewed aerials and topo's with are always amazed at awesome areas they didn't realize were good spots on their property. I put this (17yr old kid) guy in a classic funnel during the 1st week of November last year and downwind of what I thought was a pretty likely place for some kind of bedding. He ended up killing a buck that he had pics of on his plots but never seen the deer in person. He was a small 123" deer but This kid was pumped. When he called me to come out there and help him get his deer we looked at the ridge where I suspected bedding and it was a doe bedding area. He had been sitting at the edge of his plot all season up to that point and had stands pre-set on all sides for different winds.
I am not against good management practices, I am against people looking from the outside in and their only motivation is big racks and that has been the primary advertising and draw to management practices that are published outside of the QDMA, but if you are not on the inside of the organization this is what people think it is about. I would like to see hunters become better hunters, and people motivated by the adventure of the hunt not simply the racks. I am certain it is not the QDMA's intention to diminish anything from the outdoor sport of deer hunting.
I am very passionate about preserving and protecting our outdoor heritage so I have made it a personal goal of mine to promote good ethics, technical education, and seeking the adventure of the hunt for the best bucks on your property. Like I said I love shooting big bucks, but I fear this may become all the sport is about because that is what it is to the newer generation.

Good post, seems we do agree. Now how people hunt, thats something either self taught, tv taught, or generation to generation. Some states you can get away with sitting on the edge of a plot, others, well good luck trying that tactic.