B&C Rules Cell Cams Not Fair Chase

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stash59
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Re: B&C Rules Cell Cams Not Fair Chase

Unread postby stash59 » Wed Feb 02, 2022 4:27 am

SaddleMaster wrote:What about when they are 360°, 100% real-time live feed cameras and you can view multiple cameras simultaneously on your phone?


What's somewhat comical about all of this! Is this is the same kind of argument that came up! When compounds were 1st introduced. There were a small group of hardcore traditional bowhunters. Saying the same type of things about compounds!!!! How did that end up going????????? :think: :think: :think: :think: :think:

If you don't like a technology! And think it's unfair!!!Don't use it!!!!!!!!!


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Re: B&C Rules Cell Cams Not Fair Chase

Unread postby oneflag » Wed Feb 02, 2022 5:23 am

Let me start by saying I haven’t posted on the beast in a long time, but I absolutely love deer hunting, the outdoors, and the beast site, I really enjoyed meeting Dan several years ago. (Thanks Dan)

I never used trail cameras much, I’ve only had a few cheap ones over the years, but this year, a Christmas present, I started using the Cuddelink system around my home we’re I hunt. This system has worked good for the couple months I have used it and I don’t have a cell plan to pay for. I personally feel it’s an advantage to be sitting at my house and monitoring wildlife movement, even if it’s just a picture.

Technology comes at a price, and if you have the money you can stay on the cutting edge of it all. But one thing I thought about lately is technology is running like wildfire, when will it end? There’s a bigger issue that a lot of people are missing. I’m not trying to derail this thread topic. I’m thankful the for the discussion, this thread is very interesting and needs to be talked about.

My opinion, artificial intelligence is a real thing and it’s coming fast and all the stuff you daydream about is true and it’s going to happen. For example, the technology is there for a drone, with a camera, with a gun, with your cell phone, you can shoot and kill deer or anything, sounds crazy. It’s got to slow down. Boundaries need to be in place like guard railing on a bridge! Think about a bat behind the seat of your truck? It can be for a wonderful Sunday game of baseball with the church family; or beat your buddy to death after a Saturday night drunken poker game gone bad. These technology topics are very complicated. Its not about hunting deer.

Thanks for all the Beast people, we have a kindred spirit.
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Re: B&C Rules Cell Cams Not Fair Chase

Unread postby Swedishbowhunter » Wed Feb 02, 2022 7:58 am

SaddleMaster wrote:What about when they are 360°, 100% real-time live feed cameras and you can view multiple cameras simultaneously on your phone?


Then they match said camera to an xbow, you can fire it right from your phone!! No need to stink the woods up actually being out there!!
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Re: B&C Rules Cell Cams Not Fair Chase

Unread postby Dewey » Wed Feb 02, 2022 8:12 am

Swedishbowhunter wrote:
SaddleMaster wrote:What about when they are 360°, 100% real-time live feed cameras and you can view multiple cameras simultaneously on your phone?


Then they match said camera to an xbow, you can fire it right from your phone!! No need to stink the woods up actually being out there!!

Years back remote control hunting was actually attempted. Glad it was quickly shut down.

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Re: B&C Rules Cell Cams Not Fair Chase

Unread postby Chuck B » Wed Feb 02, 2022 12:10 pm

dan wrote:
Chuck B wrote:
Brian1986 wrote:I think the question of cell cameras being legal is a good discussion to have. When new technology comes out there's always an effect of some kind. An extreme example would be when cell phones & texting came out. Suddenly there was a new problem- texting and driving accidents. The facts showed that texting & driving caused an increase in wrecks. People spoke out, awarenes was raised, laws were made. Are cell cameras at that point? I don't know if they are when it comes to deer hunting in the midwest, but it appears they were in some places out west.
I don't care how another person hunts. If they are enjoying themselves and it's legal, great! I hunt for my own reasons and my own satisfaction. That being said I personally feel like cell cams are a step too far and don't use them myself. The idea that you can gather intel without a person being present I think is unfair to the deer. Even regular cameras you still have to get your scent in there to check them. I feel the same way about ozonics if any of that stuff truly works on a deer's nose. However, unless any of those things is proven to dramatically affect the deer herd in a negative way, I don't mind if other people use them. I think it's good we are talking about it.


Agreed. I think it’s a great discussion to have. It is why I started a different thread on the subject a month ago. Why someone would be “against” a discussion is concerning to me.

In MY opinion;
1- huge difference between a buddy or a neighbor giving you intel rather than a robot (cell cam).
2- how many guys are really NOT going to use the intel they might get on a large buck that day (some guys saying that they won’t use it that way)
3- not getting your scent in the woods to check camera is a HUGE advantage.
4- public perception is HUGE. And the public perception of cell cams is already not good. (We need public perception of us hunters to be decent at least)
5- there are plenty of stories on this thread and the other thread of walls being filled because of cell cams. I shared my brother in laws story on all of his neighbors recently.
6- and biggest for me, is when does it stop? My guess is that there is already production being drawn up of cell cams that will rotate around a pole and you could control with your phone. Is that ok??

Who was saying we shouldnt have a discussion? That would be concerning to me as well, but I guess I missed the posts saying we shouldnt. I personally think this is a great discussion with vary differing opinions and lots of people making good points on both sides...

#4 I have not heard any non-hunter claims that cameras are unfair. Matter of fact, I see it the complete opposite, I think the fascination of trail cam pics have gotten more people involved in hunting and kept them in hunting. However, I think that would be the same whether or not it was a regular camera or a cell cam.

#5 I don't think the hunters doing well who use cell cams would do noticeably worse without them. I think a lot of it is hype. just like with advertising for crossbows saying you can shoot deer at 10 - 150 yards, etc... Knowing where a deer is in real time is an advantage. But it don't kill them. Its a lot harder than that... The buck I shot this year, I knew where he was bedded within a few acres at almost all times over the last couple years, it sure did not hang him on the wall for me. That took luck and skill.

Another thing to consider is this... Do you think banning them will stop there use? Do you think private land guys are going to stop using them to catch poachers? Do you think they are going to stop using them to watch deer? If you ban them, your banning them from yourself... Others are still going to use them.

There are some places where they absolutely should be banned cause they are making a negative impact on wildlife herds... I personally don't see that in 90% of the areas they are in use. However, if you want to ban them, thats up to you to do... In Wisconsin the people make the changes by submitting proposed rule changes at the spring hearings. But we can't even get together to get antlerless seasons that kill more bucks than does banned, and actually does impact population... hard to believe we are going to get people to vote themselves out of using cameras...


I wasn’t referring to you Dan. But I did hear from others “sounds like Chuck needs a go fund me campaign” so I could buy a camera on the other thread. That’s the opposite of a discussion to me Dan.

As you mentioned, there have been great points brought up by both sides. I enjoy hearing all sides of it. And whether or not someone actually uses a cell cam or not (in my case I don’t), that doesn’t mean they can’t have an opinion.

Do I think banning will stop their use? No, not all of the way. Does banning poaching stop all of the poaching that happens? No. Does it stop A LOT of deer being killed at night if there wasn’t a law, of course. Never going to stop everyone, doesn’t mean we can’t make laws. Is murder illegal? Yes. Are there murders every day? Yes.

I don’t think that a few cell cams in the woods is going to get you on consistent deer that you wouldn’t have otherwise. But, I do think that it toes the line, especially in certain areas, and WILL have a negative impact in those areas (even in WI).

Would be nice if there could be a law to “allow” cams, but limit their use ; can’t use same day intel, can’t have more than one cam per 40 acres, etc. Would that be hard to manage? Sure. Do I want the job? Certainly not. But, I am not a fan of “screw it, nothings going to change anyways”. I don’t think you are like that either Dan. That’s why you show up to rally’s your support what you believe in and you “take it the extra mile” when needed. By the way, I am not saying you would support this “ban” on cell cams, just speaking in generalities of you trying for change if you believe in something.

With all that being said, for those of you adding to this thread, good work and keep it up. These discussions need to happen.
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Re: B&C Rules Cell Cams Not Fair Chase

Unread postby oneflag » Wed Feb 02, 2022 2:22 pm

Just a google search on my part.

Can you hunt the day you fly in Alaska?
Hunting after flying on the same day is prohibited not only prohibited in Alaska but many other states too. The reason behind it is quite simple. When you locate your prey from planes it gives you an advantage in hunting.
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Re: B&C Rules Cell Cams Not Fair Chase

Unread postby stash59 » Thu Feb 03, 2022 5:24 am

oneflag wrote:Just a google search on my part.

Can you hunt the day you fly in Alaska?
Hunting after flying on the same day is prohibited not only prohibited in Alaska but many other states too. The reason behind it is quite simple. When you locate your prey from planes it gives you an advantage in hunting.


But is comparing using an airplane to find, land, then shoot game! An apples to apples comparison with cell cams! Big difference in landing a plane near an animal to shoot it. Then having to drive from work to get into position. To shoot one after some cell cam intel!!! On the other hand, how big of an advantage would flying on the same day of a hunt be here in WI? To start out most of what you fly over. Would be off limits due to trespass laws! You can't just land a plane anywhere here! Like you can up in most of Alaska!!! You'd have to land at a designated airport. Have a vehicle or find a ride from the airport to the hunting area you just found your big buck at. Then try to get into a possible shooting position undetected, etc!!! So does that mean a hunter that uses a plane. To preseason scout, a popular method used by the Wensel brothers. Should be made illegal too. Cause it utilizes an airplane!!!!! Though it was the off season. Like many cell cam users do while using their cell cams!!!!

It seems most of the "stories" brought up about successful buck kills. While utilizing real time cell camera info. Involve private land, food plots/bait and preset stands!!!!! Not my cup of tea! But the hunter still probably put in a lot of work and sweat. Making their food plot. Picking and often building their "blind", etc! Planting screening plants that would allow undetected access to the blind!!! Not just a walk in the park!!

We go back to the question where does the line get drawn. How many of you wanting to ban cell cams? Would be willing to give up your range finder? A very similar and very modern technology! That really increases the odds in a bowhunter's favor! Or 80% let off highly engineered compound bows!!!! Are these technologies still in the spirit that the original "modern bowhunters". Originally intended? Heck even Saxton Pope and Art Young. Chose to shoot more technically advanced equipment. Then their mentor Ishi was building and using!!!!!

So again back to the original post. Does B&C have the right to say no cell cam assisted kills can be entered in their record books? You bet. But they don't represent the majority of hunters. So don't want them influencing states game laws in too big of a way!!!!
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Re: B&C Rules Cell Cams Not Fair Chase

Unread postby SaddleMaster » Thu Feb 03, 2022 6:16 am

stash59 wrote:
oneflag wrote:Just a google search on my part.

Can you hunt the day you fly in Alaska?
Hunting after flying on the same day is prohibited not only prohibited in Alaska but many other states too. The reason behind it is quite simple. When you locate your prey from planes it gives you an advantage in hunting.


But is comparing using an airplane to find, land, then shoot game! An apples to apples comparison with cell cams!Big difference in landing a plane near an animal to shoot it. Then having to drive from work to get into position. To shoot one after some cell cam intel!!! On the other hand, how big of an advantage would flying on the same day of a hunt be here in WI? To start out most of what you fly over. Would be off limits due to trespass laws! You can't just land a plane anywhere here! Like you can up in most of Alaska!!! You'd have to land at a designated airport. Have a vehicle or find a ride from the airport to the hunting area you just found your big buck at. Then try to get into a possible shooting position undetected, etc!!! So does that mean a hunter that uses a plane. To preseason scout, a popular method used by the Wensel brothers. Should be made illegal too. Cause it utilizes an airplane!!!!! Though it was the off season. Like many cell cam users do while using their cell cams!!!!

It seems most of the "stories" brought up about successful buck kills. While utilizing real time cell camera info. Involve private land, food plots/bait and preset stands!!!!! Not my cup of tea! But the hunter still probably put in a lot of work and sweat. Making their food plot. Picking and often building their "blind", etc! Planting screening plants that would allow undetected access to the blind!!! Not just a walk in the park!!

We go back to the question where does the line get drawn. How many of you wanting to ban cell cams? Would be willing to give up your range finder? A very similar and very modern technology! That really increases the odds in a bowhunter's favor! Or 80% let off highly engineered compound bows!!!! Are these technologies still in the spirit that the original "modern bowhunters". Originally intended? Heck even Saxton Pope and Art Young. Chose to shoot more technically advanced equipment. Then their mentor Ishi was building and using!!!!!

So again back to the original post. Does B&C have the right to say no cell cam assisted kills can be entered in their record books? You bet. But they don't represent the majority of hunters. So don't want them influencing states game laws in too big of a way!!!!



It's the perfect analogy for this. Cell cams are the airplanes of the midwest!


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