The Hunting Beast

All I will say is that if we all truly agree weapon choice should be left up to each individual then lets all get together and push for doing away with ALL special seasons (archery, muzzleloader, crossbow) and go back to the days where we just had DEER SEASON. Therein lies the problem, most likely we all would want to draw a line somewhere but who gets to determine where that line is? Personally I like equipment restrictions and the special seasons created for them.

Completely agree with all of this.

The biggest impact Ive seen is more guys in the woods earlier in the season. A lot of my uncles and great uncles used to be gun only guys. Most have added a crossbow to extend their season.

Are more deer killed? Not necessarily, at least in Ohio. But, the pressure has shifted up into October more, which for guys that don't scout, especially in-season, feel a big impact during their pre rut and rut hunts. I see less guys during our gun week, and late season is a ghost town.

I'm really jusy happy to see more guys hunting. At least with the guys I know that have picked up one, they've extended their seasons, which has given them more opportunities to introduce my younger cousins to hunting. Also, with my daughter (11), she prefers bow season to our gun week. A bit more stealth, different strategies, less guys, deer acting more naturally, she gets to be the shooter...not that she cant shoot the 12 gauge, she just prefers the crossbow. Cant blame her for that.

Kokes wrote:Here is the way I look at it.... Im not sure why so many are against crossbows:

- hunter numbers are decreasing across North America..its much easier to introduce someone to the sport with a crossbow
- most guys (and a few gals) I know (later onset hunters) start with a crossbow then they gradually move on to shoot compounds as they evolve as a hunter
- with the current price of housing and real estate..its hard to find a property that allows you the room to shoot 20-30+ yards and stay proficient with a regular bow, hence the necessity for a crossbow for some..
- the anti hunters are after us enough as it is already, so why are we dividing our seasons, dividing us hunters? we need to stay united or hunting will be a thing of the past
- the whole 100+ yard shots crossbow hunters get painted with the brush as taking, I dont know a single guy who does that, every guy I know who hunts crossbow is adamant about upgrading arrows, broadheads, etc for 20-30 yard accuracy, just like the rest of the regular bowhunters do
- many stated the benefits of a crossbow (always at full draw, scope, etc) but you only have one arrow with a crossbow..think about how many times you got a follow up arrow after a miss..that would not happen with a crossbow..

Pros and Cons to everything guys, lets keep our eye on the ball and ensure we are not dividing each other as hunters, we have enough liberal tree hugging anti's out there looking for any ammo we can give them to divide us even further...

cspot wrote:

mheichelbech wrote:What I don’t like about crossbows mainly are the price and the weights. I can buy a top of the line compound for $800-$900 but a top of the line crossbow seems to be $1,500 - $2,000. Then there’s the weight of them.

The other thing I don’t like is I know 2 guys who have killed bucks in the 160s to 180s that they openly say they couldn’t have killed with a regular compound bow. I have had bucks in that size range that I couldn’t shoot because I use a compound but I could have killed with a crossbow. So I am a tad envious to be honest. Not because of what they did but because of what I couldn’t do. I don’t know if that’s relevant to the argument or not...lol! Whatever that twisted logic is, it’s the same reason I don’t like millionaires...especially those that inherited their money. I wish I could change my attitude about that kind of stuff, but I can’t.

At one time in my life that stuff may have bothered me a bit, but not anymore. It is hard to explain but when you can give up being envious of others it can really make your own life alot more enjoyable. Not sure when that happened, but I would guess that has happened gradually over my lifetime.

Yea for the most part I don’t pay it much attention. Sometimes it does and sometimes it doesn’t. I have a lot harder time with big bucks than anything else...lol!

If it’s legal who cares . I’m with the guys if it makes are numbers greater, then that’s fine with me. We are hurting and the bashing doesn’t help. I was a compound hunter for 5 years before I had an accident. I now use a crossbow . I fractured my elbow and dislocated it , not once!. But twice. This past year was my 3rd year using a crossbow. Not once have I shot past 30, it’s heavy , and it’s not fun free handing with no rest in the stand either. It’s not as easy as some think. Especially as a mobile hunter . Crossbows have been around since the 5th century B.C.. people just need to get over it, I don’t think they are going anywhere...

Random Thoughts:
I was as big of an opponent to crossbows as you could be. Once I saw what they bring to the table I've done a 180.

I spent the first 10 years of my hunting career only gun hunting. it wasn't until I picked up a bow that I really starting learning about deer behavior.

It probably doesn't matter when your state's gun season starts, 6 hrs into opening day, you are unlikely to see "natural" movement. My childhood memories are filled with seeing and sometimes shooting at deer hauling mail from one patch of cover to
the next.

I'm all for getting more people involved earlier in the year. Better weather, more natural deer movement.

The sound of gun shots bothers me more the older I get.

My son has a compound that he shoots pretty well, I bought a cheap crossbow for him to hunt with. It's easier no doubt about it.

Hunting is competing with WAY more activities/interests than it was when I was a kid. Make no mistake, barring any catastrophic events, humanity will eventually do away with hunting. It's primative and eventually won't be needed or wanted. Getting more people involved is the only way to drag out that end date as long as possible.

If its legal and ethical, we should be ok with it.

I'm young enough to embrace change and old enough to mentally put an * in my mind next to pictures with crossbow killed deer, though I know I shouldn't.

I'm fine with them.

But call em what they are.
Tigger, locking mechanism, scope.
It's a crossbolt gun.

All for letting anyone that wants to use them do so.
During the muzeloader season.
With the other midrange fire arms.

Disclaimer: I exclusively hunt with a crossbow and love it. However, I totally understand the reason for the the gripe of allowing crossbows in archery season. I also just started hunting in my 40's. Without a crossbow, I'm not sure if I would have taken up hunting because I don't have time to practice shooting a bow often enough to feel confident in shooting at a deer. I credit the crossbow in allowing me to join the ranks as a hunter. I know at least 3 other people in my shoes. Now, we're avid public land supporters and very interested in the deer herd management and other forms of hunting.

I have been hunting with a compound bow for the past 20 some years.
I bought a recurve style crossbow 3 years ago and since then both of my kids have been killing deer with it.
Both my son and daughter killed their first with it at 9 years old.
I would like to see them move to vertical bows as they get older but that will be up to them.
Looking back they have been much more efficient with it than I was when I was getting started.

I would argue a responsible person who understands a deer’s reaction time and limits the distance of their shots accordingly is less likely to wound an animal with a crossbow than a vertical bow hunter.

I would consider using a crossbow a big advantage.

Knowing that I am happy to keep shooting the compound.

Crossbows are nice for older hunters trying to extend their years of archery season, hunters with injuries, as well as younger hunters just getting into it. It also serves a purpose for hunters who are honest with themselves in knowing their limitations, and are just not effective with a vertical bow. Actually there are probably too many vertical bow hunters out there taking non-ethical shots way beyond their effective range who probably SHOULD be hunting with a crossbow. It does kind of rub me the wrong way when an accomplished able bodied vertical bow hunter switches to the crossbow just because its easier.

I hunt with friends who use crossbows, compounds, and trad bows. We all get along just fine. That being said I do not consider crossbow hunting to be "archery" but who am I to judge. Our sport needs participants to keep this great tradition alive.

PredatoronthePrairie wrote:I'm fine with them.

But call em what they are.
Tigger, locking mechanism, scope.
It's a crossbolt gun.

All for letting anyone that wants to use them do so.
During the muzeloader season.
With the other midrange fire arms.

A crossbow is not a "midrange fire arm"
A "gun" or firearm discharges copper or lead rounds at great distances using a propellant.

Does your release have a trigger?
Does your compound have a locking mechanism after the draw so you can relax and make the shot
Does it have a sight?

By your definition you are shooting a...… Vertical GUN.. lol

Just pickin on ya, yeah I get what your saying but I disagree.

Worry about shot selection more than the weapon. If a person takes an ethical shot and fills the freezer I'm happy. Traditional archers, crossbow, compound or rifle hunters that wound deer with poor shot selection bother me much more than anything else. If your opinion is too strong towards what weapon is used your nuttier than a squirrel turd.

Kinda sad that people want things done a certain way for only the reason of they don’t like it. Sounds like most political arguments. I don’t like it so you shouldn’t have it and how dare you even bring it up because I think it’s a terrible idea and I want to do things my way so everybody should do it my way because it’s the right way after all.

Personally in Wisconsin 99% of the issues could be solved without touching crossbows. Give gun hunters 9 days and let them pick up a crossbow to bow hunt the rest of the year if they want. Give bow hunters September through January. It’s a shared resource owned by the state. Don’t want guys doing something you don’t like during “your early season”, go buy 500 acres and do your own thing.

Just doing that to the season would do so much for the hunting in the state. And make it easy for anybody to come enjoy our resources.

Button buck,

A lot of good responses here. Probably my biggest issue is ease of use when it’s time to kill. For example you are a second year hunter and you killed 3 bucks and 6 does! Probably ain’t happening with a compound or recurve. I tip my hat to you as that is pretty impressive for someone just getting started!

I think many fear we will have our season reduced significantly with those kinds of success rates. Nothing against the weapon per se but I do worry about that and think it should be in its own separate season or be allowed during the gun seasons. Since full inclusion where I live I have definitely seen more guys in the woods than I used to and many of those guys were not willing to put in the practice a bow takes prior to inclusion and hence only gun hunted.

Lee

Bio1 wrote:
I think many fear we will have our season reduced significantly with those kinds of success rates. Nothing against the weapon per se but I do worry about that and think it should be in its own separate season or be allowed during the gun seasons. Since full inclusion where I live I have definitely seen more guys in the woods than I used to and many of those guys were not willing to put in the practice a bow takes prior to inclusion and hence only gun hunted.

Those are unfounded fears as it simply hasn't happened. PA which has the highest hunter density in the country legalized crossbows in 2009 in all archery seasons. THey added 1 week of archery/flintlock season this past year along with another day of rifle. Next year they are adding an additional day of rifle along with 1 additional day of archery. They are also looking into adding another week or 2 to the archery season for 2021. All of this and PA hunter numbers have been declining less than the national average.

Hunter numbers across the country are on a decline and all indication are that they will continue to decline for a while. As hunters we will see more and more opportunities and not less.

OUr concerns should be uniting as hunters as 1 and not worried about what other groups of hunters are hunting with or how they hunt. As hunter numbers continue to drop we lose our voice politically and this is the biggest fear or concern about our future hunting seasons and opportunities.

Let us also not pretend that the compounds of today and the technology of today is anything compared to 30-40 years ago. COmpound bows today are alot easier to shoot accurately and get tuned in. Then you have the huge technology advances with treestands, rangefinders, blinds, clothing, trail cameras, etc, etc, etc. Alot of that stuff has made it "easier" to kill a deer. Heck you can get on your phone and find all the public areas open to hunting within a matter of minutes.

We all have our own ethics or preferences about what technology or methods that we use. We really shouldn't worry if someone else's view is different than ours.

What's the agenda? Getting more people is the wood (more revenue due to licence sales)? Slaughtering more deer? Actual hunter recruitment? Seems to me there was never a problem with hunter numbers or recruitment back when we had archery, gun, late archery season and paid 2 dollars to apply for a doe permit (1995 and previous years). What really the cause of the change in hunting culture?