CWD

[Tennhunter3]

I hope oneday you open a Bible my friend.
It tells the truth of what will happen.

What I posted is my belief and I stand by my post.
I knew in posting it some would not agree with it or understand.

You believe only in science that's the difference between us. I believe in Gods word written in the Bible.

Whatever you wish to call cwd a virus -plague-sickness ect it is reducing the animal herds by regulations put in place.

[JakeB]

I sometimes wonder what the world would be like if they had never tested for CWD in the first place...

[stash59]

Sorry your feelings are hurt tennhunter3, I could have worded it differently, however, I stand by the content of my post.

I do NOT find it strange that cwd has popped up and is difficult or impossible to slow down/eliminate. I don't find it strange because I understand(on a basic level) the science involving the method of transfer and prion-cell interaction.

Cwd is not a virus. A virus generally speaking is an order of magnitude larger than a prion(protein). A virus as an organism exists to replicate. It infects a cell, bursts, releasing (usually)rna inside the cell. The cell replicates the rna thus producing more viruses, the cell eventually dies or bursts and releases all of the newly created virus bodies and the cycle continues.

A prion is essentially a misfolded protein. These proteins interact with the cell in detrimental ways. For scale consider this. Proteins come in different sizes, are made up of various types and numbers of molecules, and are involved in nearly all cell life functions, from atp production to dna and rna replication. Proteins and prions are smaller than cell organelles. We are talking about a cluster of molecules. Because of the size alone, prions are tougher to combat than viruses. Now take into consideration the ability of the prion to "survive" things like high heat, not to mention things like plant uptake and transfer. It is no wonder that the dnr have no real way to deal with the issue and no wonder it's transmission rate and difficulty fighting.

The only way that I have seen protein folding corrected is through a specialized vesicle, and this is a large protein we are talking about. Misfolded protein goes into the vesicle, add catalyst and time, out pops a correctly folded and useable protein. Some species (octopuses and squid for example) are able to create vesicles that do this as well as rapidly alter their rna. This is one way they are able to change color/texture rapidly. To my limited knowledge deer nor humans have this ability naturally nor artificially, at least not outside of a lab environment. At this point, all of this equates to dealing with the prion on an organism level instead of a cellular or molecular level, aka kill the deer because they can't kill the prion itself.

This is a scientific issue and should be viewed as such. There is research out there that is repeatable and observable on this topic, that's what the scientific method is all about. Scientic evidence doesn't support the theory that these prions are man made, or that cwd has come from a private or governmental vector.

Everyone is entitled to believe what they want, but chalking cwd up to a government conspiracy and making a companion comment linking it to aids!? How is that rational or supported by any type of fact or reliable evidence? Furthermore how is it a bad thing to point this out? There is nothing wrong with challenging ideas and norms. I am open to being totally and absolutely proven wrong, often this is how conceptual breakthroughs are realized and how perceptions are changed.

Hunters tend to be a group that need first hand experience and observable evidence to cement ideas. This is why each of us hunt the way we do-because it brings results for us. To say that cwd is not out there or that you don't think it's serious and ignoring scientific observation is analogous to saying that you don't believe Eastern Asia exists because you haven't seen it with your own eyes, that the Earth is flat because you can't easily observe the curature of the earth with your eye, or that nuclear weapons aren't dangerous because you haven't seen a mushroom cloud... Again, believe what you want but there are GOOD reasons to believe the scientific research that has been done.

The group of men and women that are on this site are uniquely able to critically break down the habits, behavior, and biology of an animal, take field samples(trail cams, sit observation, etc...), then use that info to analyze and pattern the animal well enough to successfully overcome that animal's biological advantages. The ability to critically think and analyze deer, but lack of critical reasoning on some other topics is baffling to me. There seems to be a drop off between critically thinking about how to kill deer and other world, political, and social problems that are discussed on here. I would expect more people on here to ask "why" "how" regarding more than just killing deer.


Jonny, yes, the science does show that it is more serious than the flu. Claiming that cwd isn't serious is a little silly. It is a fatal disease, Has been proven so, etc.. etc... I understand your frustrations with how it has been managed and agree that there has been a poor effort made in many circumstances. My guess as to why is not conspiracy however, nor is it that cwd isn't real or serious. My guess as to the poor cwd management is due to chain of command, funding issues, lack of treatment options, and a fear of losing public and private conservation money. If you have ever dealt with or been a part of management in a large corporation you probably know that there is usually a major difference between what NEEDS to be done, what CAN be done, and what actually GETS done....again, these are complex issues spanning many thousands of people, government organizations and all in public view. Must make a single vision or plan difficult if not impossible.

Dewey, tennhunter3, I apologise. I do not want to attack anyone. I have no beef with anyone on this site but I do have an issue with people stating nonsense as if it were truth and watching others pile on. We need to be conscious of what ideas we give legs because frightening people with ideas not based in fact not only gives hunters a bad connotation, it prohibits us from taking part in a real solution. Your words have power. None of us would be on here if we weren't interested in learning and gleaning knowledge from others. People look to your words for direction, don't send them on a goose chase please.

I'm sure all of this science you've showed us is true. It's something I've seen before while researching CWD. And yes CWD is a very serious issue for any deer contracting it. And for humans if it is possible for this disease to eventually jump species.

You say science proves things by replication. Well I guess each state that is going the "eradicate the heard to get rid of CWD" route. Is proving that that method "doesn't" work!!! At the cost of all of us deer hunters.

What I have a problem with is does science "really" know how long CWD has existed. A few decades, centuries, millenia. Everywhere they start looking/testing for it. It's being found. But in very very small numbers. So is it an outbreak, or just one of those odd natural occurances that sometimes happens in nature. Because it had really never been tested for before WI did about 20-30 years ago. How can science make accurate assessments on how often it had occurred previous to that time. Before the outbreak in Colorado in the 1960's. Science didn't even know it existed. And I haven't found any 100% proof that that outbreak was caused by cross contamination of sheep with scabies. It's all speculation because no one was really paying enough attention to what was really happening back then.

You have to admit CWD has become big business. Universities and other research facilities, testing facilities, even parts of game departments are now insured work far into the future. Working to try to understand this "problem". People in the media, especially the hunting media can guarantee any story on CWD will get plenty of attention. So these stories will sell.

I don't have the answers to alot of these concerns, and in reality at this time. Neither does science!! One wonders how truthful science is being on this subject. They don't "have" to tell us any more than they want to. It's created a small histeria. But is that histeria "real"?

[Hawthorne]

I think a famous conservationist predicted 100 years ago disease or the European style of hunting only the rich get to hunt could ruin hunting in this country. Seems like both are creeping in

[bowtechjim]

There's a guy in Colorado who has killed 4 deer in the last 2 years off his property and 3 out of the 4 tested positive for CWD.

[raisins]

I really hope that this causes WV to outlaw deer baiting.

Anyways, I used to do a lot of research and went to school with a gal that studied CWD. It used to be that CWD tests had a high false positive rate (so many of the positives were not) and lower false negative rate (so false negative don't make up for the false positives in the sample). I don't know if this is the case given how they are testing now. You need to know these error rates to make sense of the data and to know if it is even likely that CWD is present in an area. I'm going to look at the error rates for the tests now and see what I can learn.

[Jonny]

I sometimes wonder what the world would be like if they had never tested for CWD in the first place...

$20 we would have more deer in Wisconsin. Or a different reason to justify killing more deer and having endless tags.

[john1984]

Send your CWD infected meat to Dan. He has no problem eating it.

[john1984]

Heck lets end this RIGHT NOW. Lets us have a All You Can Eat CWD infected meat contest.

[Dewey]

Heck lets end this RIGHT NOW. Lets us have a All You Can Eat CWD infected meat contest.

Fire up the grill. I’ll be right over.

[MrT]

First person to become a zombie wins!

[lyndon57]

Yep, I agree. Fire up the grill.
I hunt, have no desire to kill & dumpster.

[Jonny]

Heck lets end this RIGHT NOW. Lets us have a All You Can Eat CWD infected meat contest.

Fire up the grill. I’ll be right over.

30 seconds a side and chase it down with my fork. I’m game

Heck even venison with cwd is probably better for you than government inspected product of Mexico tbones for $5.99 a pound.