Do You Think More Big Boys Die of Old Age than Most of Us Might First Think?

[Double Draw]

So two things make me wonder about this question. 1) Much of the public I hunt in the very pressured state of PA has sections, sometimes 100's of acres in size, that are so thick with dogwood, multiflora rose, and other growth you literally could not carry a stand in and hope to stay silent. It makes hunting a mature buck nearly impossible to get to and outside of maybe 3 days during the rut maybe there is little to no chance to get to him due to the literal impossibility of seeing him. And I haven't even factored in private. 2) I recently read a book about some legendary whitetails, not necessarily the highest scoring bucks of all-time but the top ones were in there and some that were plenty big (all Booners) but with interesting stories. What blew me away is how many of them did not die at the hands of a hunter but by train/car/old age/some mysterious factor. I understand the odds of a buck getting to 4.5 or 5.5 in pressured areas is not great but is it possible once they do that a decent number of deer don't die from a bullet/arrow? Like a trout that is caught and released, and quickly gets an education, a deer in its early years may slip through with a few near misses and now becomes almost impossible to harvest. I know for many of us that is what beast hunting is all about but how successful do you think we are? Thoughts?

[Jackson Marsh]

I think it happens. Say a buck is a naturally shy non-aggressive type buck. I can think of dozens of spots where I hunt that a buck like that is virtually un-killable because of certain regulations.

Sure they might make a mistake during the rut or get whacked during a gun deer drive, but if the marsh is not frozen during gun season the buck could live to be very old.

[Boogieman1]

My opinion is if a buck survives his 4th hunting season he has better odds of dying of old age than meeting his doom by a hunter. By this time a buck has not only learned to slip a hunter but how to avoid the situation all together. A very small percentage of hunters have the time and knowledge to pursue these ghosts. There found dead every year in heavily pressured areas where it seems there's a hunter behind every tree. Not only did the hunters never see him, they never even new he existed.

[hunter10]

I tend to think not as many die of old age. I think more in their old age get run down and the yotes, disease or vehicles find them.

[mauser06]

Most of PA is easily driven out. Even big game lands up north...break it down and it's easy enough to push...there's just no truly large chunks of land with no road access here and we still have enough hunters to do it. The "unhuntable" deer in urban areas are likely to get dinged by a vehcile.

There's probably some in PA....but I doubt there's too many.


Your scenario might be hard for you to hunt from a stand. But put a couple guys in there and your thick area is pushed out and the deer are shot on the other end.


IMO it'd take pretty big woods and light hunting pressure for deer to die of old age regularly.

I hunt big public regularly and for a while I was kinda surprised at how deep some guys will go...and even more surprised that crews will go in deep and push everything back to the road.

[dewayne]

I think so, they may not live to 7 or 8 y/o but I bet a lot of them make it 4+

[Buckbreath]

I think in certain areas many bucks make it to 7 years or older. One spot I hunt I have pictures of 3 different bucks for 5 years in a row. This is on land nobody else has deer hunted on those last 5 years(1000+acres).

[Lockdown]

I've thought about this topic quite a bit. I know it happens, but I think the ones that truly die of old age itself aren't all that common around here. I know of a few really big ones that have just disappeared. With cell phones and the internet big buck kills usually spread like wildfire.

I think often times natural factors like coyotes, falling through a half frozen river or slew and drowning, tooth abscess, maybe dying from an infected puncture wound from a buck fight, etc kill more than the amount that die from their teeth being so worn they can't chew anymore, or they're so old their heart just stops.

My .02

[bigbucks1234]

Care to share the title of the book your reading and author??? Sounds like a good read. I would say natural selection takes place more than people would think by predation for sure. And then of course the front end of a buick if a yote or timberwolf hasn't gotten them. As far as just tipping over from old age, i bet kinda rare.

[Ladykiller]

Having seen some 200+ inch giants at night in Kansas and Illinois, they do die of old age if they have the right land, either public or private. Anything that makes that buck hard to hunt, hidden, etc plus great food sources.

[Steelhead125]

I believe some of the areas I hunt in PA definitely have deer dying of old age or at least never had a human lay eyes on it.
During archery I never see another hunter in the woods all season.The ones that do hunt up there during archery don’t get in very deep.
Rifle season is but a shell of its former self. Don’t have the big gangs doing deer drives anymore either. Five or six guys putting on drives in the mountains just isn’t enough. Not saying it never works but more often than not a mature buck will know how to escape these drives.
I also feel deer get into places that most guys aren’t willing to walk to and the hunters who are capable of making the journey turn back when they take the drag into consideration.
How many hunters do we know here in PA would actually quarter a deer in the field to get it out ? Some places that’s about the only practical way to do it. You could also get 8 to 10 guys to help you but that’s not easy either. Not easy to ask guys to drop what they are doing to come help you drag a deer late at night when they may possibly have to work in the morning or got something else going on. I shot a buck already and plan on hunting bear when it comes in in another week. I am very concerned about getting enough help if I manage to get one.
Where I hunt there are not many roads and the ones that are around are mountain country roads. No agricultural for 10 miles or more. These deer basically stay in a core area deep in the woods year round.
I definitely believe derr are dying up there that were never seen by another hunter.

[brancher147]

Nothing has ever died of old age. But sure plenty of mature animals die from natural causes, predation, or health issues/disease.

[ghoasthunter]

not buy me every deer will eventually die of unnatural causes. most of them i find dead were either injured buy a car or hit with buckshot from the orange army.

[ThePreBanMan]

In my neck of the woods - absolutely. Here in liberal lala land (East Coast of MA) huge tracts of woods are closed off to hunting via town ordinances that prohibit the discharge of archery or firearms. So old age - really is the only way they can go in said areas. That because all forms of hunting are illegal in said areas resulting from the archery/firearms discharge prohibitions. So yep - lots of big boys die of old age around these parts.

[Double Draw]

Care to share the title of the book your reading and author??? Sounds like a good read. I would say natural selection takes place more than people would think by predation for sure. And then of course the front end of a buick if a yote or timberwolf hasn't gotten them. As far as just tipping over from old age, i bet kinda rare.

Sure, it is called Legendary Whitetails: Stories and Photos of 40 of the Greatest Bucks of All Time by Dick Idol. I borrowed it from the library as it looks to be one of those $40-$50 books.