Finding a Big Buck

[Kraftd]

Great thread.

Here's a question I beat around in my head a lot. If I can only get out practically 1-3 times a week, am I better off focusing on one property and bouncing around on it, or bouncing properties from off-season scouting, assuming I don't have a specific bead on a specific buck?

The question is a little rhetorical and goes to Dan's comment on page 1 about there even being some less than ideal advice here on the beast. From a proximity and time perspective, I can get maybe three sits in in a good week if I'm lucky through middle October, then I usually take a week or more to hunt most days during the last week of October into mid November. What I have been doing the last four years is throwing a wide net. Hunting a different property just about every sit. I have felt close, but behind. Late last year I rethought my approach and started focusing on two properties that I know/suspect always have at least a couple of good bucks around. I focused what limited scouting time I have had this year on small pieces of these properties. My intent this year is that when I hunt public, to limit myself to these two properties, and try and throw a sit at everything I've spent a couple of years wanting to get to, and also scout a lot more in-season here, but with a purpose and an eye towards stacking.

I'm cautiously optimisitc about this approach. It dawned on me that pretty much immediately upon getting on the beast, my success on all of the private properties I hunt, and know very well, skyrocketed. The first season after the beast I killed two mature bucks on one property I had hunted for five years and only killed one before that.

In the same time frame I'm seeing more deer and getting closer on public, but the learning curve is immensely higher. One variable I can control somewhat, is to try and get to know a couple of properties intimately, instead of trying to know a little about 20 properties. I kind of figure i I can add two properties a year with 5-10 sits each, I'll have much better success than always looking for the next parcel or spot.

I guess the overall point that I've realized is, there is an overwhelming amount of info here, and almost an infinite number of ways to apply ti to specific properties. When I tried to do that to too wide an area, it just lead to being a little overwhelmed, and largely behind the deer. I'm pretty confident that if I could be in the woods 5-7 days a week, getting over that hump would be much easier, but I can't, so I've decided it's time to narrow my scope down.

[creepingdeth]

This has prob. been touched on already..but if you are bed hunting and starting to get on beds....eventually you'll find that super set-up that holds Mr. Primo. Even if he's not there(or dead ), the next best guy waiting in line should move in. Earlier someone mentioned that if you see a mature buck, he's probably bedded very close by. No shortcuts to decent bucks...

[dan]

Great thread.

Here's a question I beat around in my head a lot. If I can only get out practically 1-3 times a week, am I better off focusing on one property and bouncing around on it, or bouncing properties from off-season scouting, assuming I don't have a specific bead on a specific buck?

The question is a little rhetorical and goes to Dan's comment on page 1 about there even being some less than ideal advice here on the beast. From a proximity and time perspective, I can get maybe three sits in in a good week if I'm lucky through middle October, then I usually take a week or more to hunt most days during the last week of October into mid November. What I have been doing the last four years is throwing a wide net. Hunting a different property just about every sit. I have felt close, but behind. Late last year I rethought my approach and started focusing on two properties that I know/suspect always have at least a couple of good bucks around. I focused what limited scouting time I have had this year on small pieces of these properties. My intent this year is that when I hunt public, to limit myself to these two properties, and try and throw a sit at everything I've spent a couple of years wanting to get to, and also scout a lot more in-season here, but with a purpose and an eye towards stacking.

I'm cautiously optimisitc about this approach. It dawned on me that pretty much immediately upon getting on the beast, my success on all of the private properties I hunt, and know very well, skyrocketed. The first season after the beast I killed two mature bucks on one property I had hunted for five years and only killed one before that.

In the same time frame I'm seeing more deer and getting closer on public, but the learning curve is immensely higher. One variable I can control somewhat, is to try and get to know a couple of properties intimately, instead of trying to know a little about 20 properties. I kind of figure i I can add two properties a year with 5-10 sits each, I'll have much better success than always looking for the next parcel or spot.

I guess the overall point that I've realized is, there is an overwhelming amount of info here, and almost an infinite number of ways to apply ti to specific properties. When I tried to do that to too wide an area, it just lead to being a little overwhelmed, and largely behind the deer. I'm pretty confident that if I could be in the woods 5-7 days a week, getting over that hump would be much easier, but I can't, so I've decided it's time to narrow my scope down.

tHATS THE MILLION DOLLAR QUESTION... To much pressure and you might burn the area, to little and you don't kill the buck. I have had it work both ways.... I can say that a lot of the time if I know a big buck is living mostly on one property I can hunt I am capable of hunting him down and killing him. But, I also know some of my best bedding areas will produce a buck if I hunt them. So moving between bedding areas on differing properties probably works better for me, but sometimes I just want to focus on one target.

[isitseasonyet?]

This has prob. been touched on already..but if you are bed hunting and starting to get on beds....eventually you'll find that super set-up that holds Mr. Primo. Even if he's not there(or dead ), the next best guy waiting in line should move in. Earlier someone mentioned that if you see a mature buck, he's probably bedded very close by. No shortcuts to decent bucks...

This could be a part of it too. I am confident that a few of my areas are primary bedding used often by bucks. Some spots I’m just not sure....

[Lockdown]

One variable I can control somewhat, is to try and get to know a couple of properties intimately, instead of trying to know a little about 20 properties.

Excellent advice IMO. I made the mistake of spreading myself too thin when I first started with Beast tactics. I scouted too many different properties and didn’t get to know them well enough. I tried to set up in the best of the best at each one and THOUGHT I had accomplished that. Some were good, but some weren’t.

If you cast a smaller net and get to know a couple properties very intimately, you learn more and you learn that property faster. It’s then that you find the BEST bedding and see WHY it’s the best. You also see the overlooked bedding and see why it appealed to the buck(s) as well. You confirm the doe bedding with rut sign in/near it too. Then you can take that knowledge and apply it to other properties in the future. It’s easier (for me anyway) to break down the sign that way.

In my early days I was wrong with my assumptions quite a bit. And the only reason I figured out I was wrong was by seeing the movement first hand. If you spread yourself too thin you end up missing a lot of that movement.

I learned a ton by observing in the field in the summer months. Running cam is hugely beneficial, IMO observing first hand is the next best thing if you can’t run cams on public.

I would strongly suggest in the field observations. Those bucks like to hang out in low spots where they can’t be seen from the road. I would say my shooter sightings tripled when I finally got out of the truck and fought the ticks and bugs. Lots of spray AND Thermacell are a must.

[tgreeno]

One variable I can control somewhat, is to try and get to know a couple of properties intimately, instead of trying to know a little about 20 properties.

Excellent advice IMO. I made the mistake of spreading myself too thin when I first started with Beast tactics. I scouted too many different properties and didn’t get to know them well enough. I tried to set up in the best of the best at each one and THOUGHT I had accomplished that. Some were good, but some weren’t.

If you cast a smaller net and get to know a couple properties very intimately, you learn more and you learn that property faster. It’s then that you find the BEST bedding and see WHY it’s the best. You also see the overlooked bedding and see why it appealed to the buck(s) as well. You confirm the doe bedding with rut sign in/near it too. Then you can take that knowledge and apply it to other properties in the future. It’s easier (for me anyway) to break down the sign that way.

In my early days I was wrong with my assumptions quite a bit. And the only reason I figured out I was wrong was by seeing the movement first hand. If you spread yourself too thin you end up missing a lot of that movement.

I learned a ton by observing in the field in the summer months. Running cam is hugely beneficial, IMO observing first hand is the next best thing if you can’t run cams on public.

I would strongly suggest in the field observations. Those bucks like to hang out in low spots where they can’t be seen from the road. I would say my shooter sightings tripled when I finally got out of the truck and fought the ticks and bugs. Lots of spray AND Thermacell are a must.

Solid advice! Observation sits are going to be a big part of my late summer routine. I need to get eyes on some solid intel before the season this year!

[Bucky]

I hunted a mature buck for 4yrs.... only saw him from the stand twice before I killed em. Just for perspective.... trailcams told me he was in the same vicinity yr after yr.

How often is the day you kill the buck the very first time you have seen him or knew about him other than scouting in the spring?

Rarely

I found a buck on Camera once Oct 27-28-29... killed em 2nd hunt on Nov 6th I think. That is about as quick as it ever happened on purpose.

[Kraftd]

I think Bucky's last post emphasizes a good point. I'd wager to guess that most of the guys on here hunting individual deer, even on public, are running cams pretty hard. If you're not doing that, you're absolutely doing more guessing inherently than those who are. For me, running cams on the high pressured public I hunt is not something I'm willing to risk. I don't want to commit to losing cams to theft every year. I accept that that, and not being able to be out and about several days a week, will always make it hard for me to hone in on individual bucks.

That gets to my previous post about deciding that I'm best to spend a year or two really learning the couple of properties I have the most faith in. These also happen to be two of the three biggest properties that are close enough to me for week day sits. To Dan's point, could mean I contribute to buggering them up, but that will also teach me how the deer react, another key piece about knowing a property that I'm willing to risk to get to know it.

[headgear]

Here's a question I beat around in my head a lot. If I can only get out practically 1-3 times a week, am I better off focusing on one property and bouncing around on it, or bouncing properties from off-season scouting, assuming I don't have a specific bead on a specific buck?

I think there are a few long and amazing threads dedicated to this questions really people on both sides make some great points. Obviously you want to have it both ways and over time I think you eventually get there. If I had accesss to some prime land where you know bucks are living I think putting in some extra time scouting/hunting there will help in a huge way. If its more middle of the ground type land I might bounce around a little more until you find something good, I try and focus only on the best of the best bedding areas in these kinds of situations because hunting marginal buck beds on marginal land can really slow everything down and drive you a little crazy. Right now I feel I'm kind of in the middle, I have a few spots I spend a decent amount of my season on and I re-scout them and I am trying to learn the area more every season. It is for sure starting to pay off with some new discoveries. However I still try and add to my buck bedding "portfolio" every year and throw some hunts at some new areas, sometimes you just need a break and trying something new can be a great way to do that. I have a ton of land scouted but I even throw a going in blind hunt every now and then just to change things up.

[Kraftd]

Here's a question I beat around in my head a lot. If I can only get out practically 1-3 times a week, am I better off focusing on one property and bouncing around on it, or bouncing properties from off-season scouting, assuming I don't have a specific bead on a specific buck?

I think there are a few long and amazing threads dedicated to this questions really people on both sides make some great points. Obviously you want to have it both ways and over time I think you eventually get there.If I had accesss to some prime land where you know bucks are living I think putting in some extra time scouting/hunting there will help in a huge way. If its more middle of the ground type land I might bounce around a little more until you find something good, I try and focus only on the best of the best bedding areas in these kinds of situations because hunting marginal buck beds on marginal land can really slow everything down and drive you a little crazy. Right now I feel I'm kind of in the middle, I have a few spots I spend a decent amount of my season on and I re-scout them and I am trying to learn the area more every season. It is for sure starting to pay off with some new discoveries. However I still try and add to my buck bedding "portfolio" every year and throw some hunts at some new areas, sometimes you just need a break and trying something new can be a great way to do that. I have a ton of land scouted but I even throw a going in blind hunt every now and then just to change things up.

This is sort of the key for me. People come here and see some the guys who have out in hundreds of miles of scouting over a decade or three and think they can catch-up in two years. For me, I'm just admitting (I kind of already realized it) that with somewhat limited spring scouting time and not having decades of knoweldge and experience built up, I think I will be more successful focusing on a couple of properties every year or two, and building from there. I've proven to myself I can make these tactics work wonderfully if I know the terrain intimately, just admitting that on the public I hunt, with lower deer numbers anyways, I need to know the land much better. If I can't scout it as hard as I want in spring, then I'll use hunting it to start to build that.

[Lastcast#1]

Same boat here, limited experience. This doesnt happen overnight. While dropping my last 2 cams in a swamp today my buddy and I discussed this very thing. He has 35 years of experience. I have 4. I have done a ton of scouting over many different public game areas. I am only just now putting the pieces together on maybe 20 percent of the areas I hunt. Not a coincidence that most of my time has been spent in that 20 percent.

My buddy hunts more areas than I do because he knows more of these places intimately. I am always scouting, but come season I narrow it down a bit. As I learn, I move on to other areas I have scouted and repeat. Like others, to keep it fresh I hunt areas I am less familiar with throughout the season. " Controlled expansion". :)

Chad

[Lockdown]

Here's a question I beat around in my head a lot. If I can only get out practically 1-3 times a week, am I better off focusing on one property and bouncing around on it, or bouncing properties from off-season scouting, assuming I don't have a specific bead on a specific buck?

I think there are a few long and amazing threads dedicated to this questions really people on both sides make some great points. Obviously you want to have it both ways and over time I think you eventually get there.If I had accesss to some prime land where you know bucks are living I think putting in some extra time scouting/hunting there will help in a huge way. If its more middle of the ground type land I might bounce around a little more until you find something good, I try and focus only on the best of the best bedding areas in these kinds of situations because hunting marginal buck beds on marginal land can really slow everything down and drive you a little crazy. Right now I feel I'm kind of in the middle, I have a few spots I spend a decent amount of my season on and I re-scout them and I am trying to learn the area more every season. It is for sure starting to pay off with some new discoveries. However I still try and add to my buck bedding "portfolio" every year and throw some hunts at some new areas, sometimes you just need a break and trying something new can be a great way to do that. I have a ton of land scouted but I even throw a going in blind hunt every now and then just to change things up.

This is sort of the key for me. People come here and see some the guys who have out in hundreds of miles of scouting over a decade or three and think they can catch-up in two years. For me, I'm just admitting (I kind of already realized it) that with somewhat limited spring scouting time and not having decades of knoweldge and experience built up, I think I will be more successful focusing on a couple of properties every year or two, and building from there. I've proven to myself I can make these tactics work wonderfully if I know the terrain intimately, just admitting that on the public I hunt, with lower deer numbers anyways, I need to know the land much better. If I can't scout it as hard as I want in spring, then I'll use hunting it to start to build that.

Same here. With my little ones at home I basically have my hands tied. I think I made it out twice during prime scouting after snow melt. Luckily I got a ton of scouting in my first two years. That sped my learning curve up quite a bit. I do still try to hit up a new property here and there just in case I luck out and find a gold mine.

To be honest the biggest thing I took away from those early days was where NOT to look. I spent a lot of time scouting in areas I didn’t think would be that good, but wasn’t sure. So I checked it out. Then same thing for hunting. Sometimes I had to give stuff a try just for the sake of learning. After a few seasons I found myself in scouting bedding areas thinking “I would have been pretty excited about this spot a couple years ago.” It just takes time to differentiate the decent from the good, and the good from the exceptional. I can tell you the exceptional spots are few and far between. At least they are for me.

[MN_DeerHunter]

Here's a link to another great thread on this topic: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=33521

[isitseasonyet?]

How often would you say it’s beneficial to sit an observation type stand over an area you have previously scouted?

Seems like a risk, but one worth taking for that valuable info.

You could either end up seeing the buck do something you didn’t expect and get info to kill him. Confirm your scouting so when you go in for the kill it’s easier to have high confidence. Or you could end up ruining the area with your scent, and spook the buck. Since you’re gonna leave scent anyways is it better to just go in for the kill right away?

What are your thoughts on an observation stand as a tactic to find big bucks and boost confidence before getting in REAL close?

[Evanszach7]

How often would you say it’s beneficial to sit an observation type stand over an area you have previously scouted?

Pretty situational to me. Open timber hunting terrain where I’ve scoured but have no previous stand time there, I’m setting up an observation. Ex: found a buck bedding area on a series of rolling hills this summer. Looks like a primary bed based on the sign. I’m doing an observation on the next hill over across a creek about 200 yards away. I should be able to see him come into the staging area and could get a shot if he’s really moving. I’ve been burned too many times pushing in too far on the first sit.

If it looks like a secondary or seasonal bed where visibility is 50 yards or less, I’m diving right in and killing or moving on. Sometimes if I see nothing but want to try it a second time, typically 3-4 weeks later, I’ll leave a camera on a travel corridor leading to that spot. Depending on the camera intel and sign in that area, I’ll hunt it or push on assuming I’ve stacked the buck further back.

Seems like a risk, but one worth taking for that valuable info.

You could either end up seeing the buck do something you didn’t expect and get info to kill him. Confirm your scouting so when you go in for the kill it’s easier to have high confidence. Or you could end up ruining the area with your scent, and spook the buck. Since you’re gonna leave scent anyways is it better to just go in for the kill right away?

What are your thoughts on an observation stand as a tactic to find big bucks and boost confidence before getting in REAL close?