Scent Stream and Air Flow Around Objects - Hunt The Front

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weatherdude
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Re: Scent Stream and Air Flow Around Objects - Hunt The Front

Unread postby weatherdude » Thu Oct 19, 2017 4:57 am

Bedbug wrote:Very interesting stuff. Thanks for sharing! Seeing how very knowledgeable you are in this field.

Do you have an opinion on atmospheric pressure in relation to Deer activity?

Also I've noticed occasionally changes in activity that correspond to calm mornings with a very high dew point but no other distinct weather to blame. Would a high dew point or "humidity" change the viscosity of air to the point that it would flow differently?
I mean wet ground equals quite movement. I consider that partially to blame. But do you think the high moisture could change air flow in any way that makes the deer act differently than they do on a dry calm morning?


You know I'm still trying to figure out myself if pressure changes really affect deer behavior or if it's just the weather changes that are associated with them. Seems like a lot of people when they talk about pressure changes they'll say something like "we had a cold front push through last night and the pressure is rising today," maybe under the impression that that's not always the case. In general, pressure is always going to rise behind a cold front because the air is cold and sinking down to the ground behind the front, therefore creating high pressure. Is it the temperature change that deer react to, is it the pressure? I don't really know. But I will say that I don't know any part of the deer anatomy responsible for detecting pressure changes. They have pretty much all the same organs as we do. So with that in mind maybe pressure is not such a big factor and it's more of a temperature thing. Don't run me out of town for saying that but that's just my intuition.

Now as far as humidity goes, water vapor has a relatively similar viscosity to dry air. They are going to differ slightly but not enough to have a major impact on the turbulence of the air. In my mind the biggest factor with humid conditions would be the fact that water molecules will catch your scent molecules much more efficiently than just air. It's going to benefit the deer in humid conditions because different odors are going to be transported more efficiently. On cold days it will be a bit less efficient because the air is more dense and tends to sink but still more so than a dry day. Hopefully that answers your question!


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Re: Scent Stream and Air Flow Around Objects - Hunt The Front

Unread postby Bedbug » Thu Oct 19, 2017 5:24 am

weatherdude wrote:
Bedbug wrote:Very interesting stuff. Thanks for sharing! Seeing how very knowledgeable you are in this field.

Do you have an opinion on atmospheric pressure in relation to Deer activity?

Also I've noticed occasionally changes in activity that correspond to calm mornings with a very high dew point but no other distinct weather to blame. Would a high dew point or "humidity" change the viscosity of air to the point that it would flow differently?
I mean wet ground equals quite movement. I consider that partially to blame. But do you think the high moisture could change air flow in any way that makes the deer act differently than they do on a dry calm morning?


You know I'm still trying to figure out myself if pressure changes really affect deer behavior or if it's just the weather changes that are associated with them. Seems like a lot of people when they talk about pressure changes they'll say something like "we had a cold front push through last night and the pressure is rising today," maybe under the impression that that's not always the case. In general, pressure is always going to rise behind a cold front because the air is cold and sinking down to the ground behind the front, therefore creating high pressure. Is it the temperature change that deer react to, is it the pressure? I don't really know. But I will say that I don't know any part of the deer anatomy responsible for detecting pressure changes. They have pretty much all the same organs as we do. So with that in mind maybe pressure is not such a big factor and it's more of a temperature thing. Don't run me out of town for saying that but that's just my intuition.

Now as far as humidity goes, water vapor has a relatively similar viscosity to dry air. They are going to differ slightly but not enough to have a major impact on the turbulence of the air. In my mind the biggest factor with humid conditions would be the fact that water molecules will catch your scent molecules much more efficiently than just air. It's going to benefit the deer in humid conditions because different odors are going to be transported more efficiently. On cold days it will be a bit less efficient because the air is more dense and tends to sink but still more so than a dry day. Hopefully that answers your question!


That makes perfect sense! Really put some puzzle pieces together for me. I considered the moisture having an effect on scent but honestly didn't know..
Thanks a bunch glad we have you on the forum!
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Re: Scent Stream and Air Flow Around Objects - Hunt The Front

Unread postby Wetfoot » Thu Oct 19, 2017 5:26 am

Nice visual. It would be alot more useful as a hunting visualization if you could simulate the thermal effects of daytime heating and cooling. Heating and cooling of lakes, swamps, ponds in relation to wind direction etc....:think:
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Re: Scent Stream and Air Flow Around Objects - Hunt The Front

Unread postby Buckshot20 » Thu Oct 19, 2017 5:31 am

Great video and visuals. Thanks
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Re: Scent Stream and Air Flow Around Objects - Hunt The Front

Unread postby Dewey » Thu Oct 19, 2017 5:35 am

Great example of a thermal tunnel when the wind blows against a ridge. It would be even more pronounced if you added a rising thermal on the other side. Good stuff. Nothing like a great visual to explain something. 8-)
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Re: Scent Stream and Air Flow Around Objects - Hunt The Front

Unread postby <DK> » Thu Oct 19, 2017 6:05 am

I posted these awhile back, figured share again for the discussion.

*Thermal Demonstration Using Water
https://youtu.be/KfJvymo_BYE

*Flag Demonstration - Prevailing Wind vs Thermal Current (Try not to fall alseep)
https://youtu.be/BnM4GKWM1ws
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Re: Scent Stream and Air Flow Around Objects - Hunt The Front

Unread postby weatherdude » Thu Oct 19, 2017 6:21 am

Wetfoot wrote:Nice visual. It would be alot more useful as a hunting visualization if you could simulate the thermal effects of daytime heating and cooling. Heating and cooling of lakes, swamps, ponds in relation to wind direction etc....:think:


Thanks Wetfoot. You make a great point. I am considering doing a separate video on 'thermals' because they are a quite different subject than just flow characteristics, especially for hunting. It's a bit trickier to find good visual videos for this subject, but I'll find one soon and maybe get a video up about it next week.
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Re: Scent Stream and Air Flow Around Objects - Hunt The Front

Unread postby weatherdude » Thu Oct 19, 2017 6:22 am

Dewey wrote:Great example of a thermal tunnel when the wind blows against a ridge. It would be even more pronounced if you added a rising thermal on the other side. Good stuff. Nothing like a great visual to explain something. 8-)


Thank you Dewey!
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Re: Scent Stream and Air Flow Around Objects - Hunt The Front

Unread postby Harvestor » Thu Oct 19, 2017 1:04 pm

This was really helpful. Here is another video I found that is a visual aid for hills-- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ffrK8LBzt-Y
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Re: Scent Stream and Air Flow Around Objects - Hunt The Front

Unread postby <DK> » Thu Oct 19, 2017 1:14 pm

Harvestor wrote:This was really helpful. Here is another video I found that is a visual aid for hills-- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ffrK8LBzt-Y


That is perfect! Great find
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Re: Scent Stream and Air Flow Around Objects - Hunt The Front

Unread postby brancher147 » Thu Oct 19, 2017 11:37 pm

I hunted tuesday morning after our cold front and had super high pressure. I was hunting in some cliffs on top of an east facing ridge. When the sun came up and hit the valley it started pulling fog up from the bottom of the valley. Pretty soon I was covered in fog and could not see more than 50 yards. But it was really neat to watch the water vapor rise and see how it changed when it hit objects and when it hit the cliffs. It was a calm morning but the fog was rising straight up at an incredible pace, and I could see lower down in the valley where it was spinning and swirling, which is why I like to sit up high where less swirling occurs. The way the sun was low in the sky and shining through the fog, I had a perfect view of exactly what was happening for about an hour. Now I know why deer can't smell me in this spot. My milkweed would always do crazy stuff and spin around and usually go up and over the cliffs or just fall where I was sitting. But my milkweed could never get into the main thermals as I am essentially hunting from inside the rock cliffs with rocks on one side of me and overhead, so I have a little micro current swirling around my spot and making my milkweed do crazy things.
Some do. Some don't. I just might...


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