Ghost bucks

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Buck_shooter
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Ghost bucks

Unread postby Buck_shooter » Wed Jun 07, 2017 1:17 am

I've always been of the mindset that any bucks are huntable but there are two scenarios that have me questioning that. The first one involves a guy who guides for whitetails and lives hunting year round. Even with guiding he still manages to kill a wall hanger or two for himself just about every year. Even with his careful checking of cameras and keeping scent to a minimum there is one buck that he has only been able to lay eyes on once. While out checking cameras one day he ran across what he said was easily the biggest buck he had ever personally seen. He's never seen the buck before or since and never gotten a single picture of him. From my understanding this was mid day during the late summer just after the velvet was shed so I would think he would have been right in his core area at the time.

The second story is of another locally well known hunter who has been trying for a particular buck for the last three years. He and some other guys scout and hunt year round on several properties and on one of them they have found sheds from a gnarly looking 12 point for 3 years in a row. Each year the sheds get bigger and more impressive but nobody has yet laid eyes on it. Between all of the cameras, hours spent hunting and driving around spotlighting they have never seen him. And none of the people on neighboring properties have either. If it weren't for the shed antlers nobody would seem to have any clue this deer even exists.

It does make me wonder how many bucks are out there that are able to completely avoid cameras and people their entire lives. They do have to leave sign though and I think Dan's tactics are the only way these deer will ever be taken by a hunter.


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Re: Ghost bucks

Unread postby csoult » Wed Jun 07, 2017 1:31 am

Studies of gps collared bucks have shown that they go on an excursion a couple time a times a year. Could the buck in your first instance be one of those situations?
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Re: Ghost bucks

Unread postby headgear » Wed Jun 07, 2017 1:51 am

Just from what you are describing I don't know that the bucks spend a lot of time where these people are hunting, if a giant shows up out of the blue and is never seen again it could just be a random thing. With the second buck it could be seasonal, he might live somewhere else but spend in the winter in their area after hunting season has ended and then head back to his home range in the spring. These are just purely guesses on my part, they could be living right under their noses and just really good at avoiding hunters. Deer also have huge home ranges and they are not easy to kill if you are hunting a tiny section of land, even a square mile is not enough somtimes.
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Re: Ghost bucks

Unread postby mheichelbech » Wed Jun 07, 2017 2:28 am

Guy killed a 305 inch buck in northern Indiana in shotgun season. Despite being an avid hunter he had never seen it and I'm not anyone else or maybe just 1 or 2 people had seen it before the day he killed it. Amazing....305 inches going unseen.
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Re: Ghost bucks

Unread postby Steve Heiting » Wed Jun 07, 2017 2:50 am

headgear wrote:Just from what you are describing I don't know that the bucks spend a lot of time where these people are hunting, if a giant shows up out of the blue and is never seen again it could just be a random thing. With the second buck it could be seasonal, he might live somewhere else but spend in the winter in their area after hunting season has ended and then head back to his home range in the spring. These are just purely guesses on my part, they could be living right under their noses and just really good at avoiding hunters. Deer also have huge home ranges and they are not easy to kill if you are hunting a tiny section of land, even a square mile is not enough somtimes.


What Headgear said is spot on ...

If the buck is indeed a "ghost" or lives somewhere else, I think the only time to kill it is during the rut. Several times during the rut my cameras have taken pictures of bucks that were there once and never again. I figure a doe comes into heat and the buck has to check out the action, then once she's bred he's off to somewhere else.

My largest buck was one we had pictures of for three years, but only at my buddy's stand a half-mile away. I never had a single picture of him at my stand until the night before I killed him. That night there was the buck I killed, a 10-pointer I'd never gotten photos of before (nor since), and two resident 8-pointers. The deer seemed to be on the move in all the pictures. During the day a buck fawn wandered past my stand four times, making me think his mom was off "partying" somewhere. The buck I killed (15-pointer, 178 4/8") stepped into my shooting lane 11 minutes before the end of shooting hours that evening, and it was the first time either my buddy or I had actually seen it.

The only time my cameras ever got pictures of a 9-pointer I eventually killed was during the rut and at night. The first picture was a full portrait, in which I could see the whole animal and rack. After that, the buck was looking at the camera in every photo and only about half of his rack would be pictured. I only ever got a handful of pictures of him, during the remainder of the rut that season and then at the start of the rut the next year. I killed him the second year with six minutes to go during legal shooting hours when he stepped out of a swamp to pursue a doe that was on the other side of my stand tree.

It's encouraging but often frustrating to know big bucks are in the area, but thankfully they do make mistakes.
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Re: Ghost bucks

Unread postby stash59 » Wed Jun 07, 2017 3:05 am

When I was a kid every once in awhile a big mature buck would show up in Pops alfalfa field during the summer. Strangely it often happened in the evenings after a day of severe thunderstorms. That broke and the sun popped out not long before sunset. Some of these bucks would end up getting killed that gun season. Most of those kills occurred 5 miles or more from the folk's property.

So I don't believe that mature bucks always stay in their core area all summer. The above mentioned study shows that happening.

I also believe that in some areas deer have summer ranges that are miles away from their fall ranges. In my late teens and early 20's I'd often come across bachelor groups of bucks hanging out in a certain area. Then never see hide or hair of any of them come fall. Yeah some of it was probably do to my lack of hunting skills. But often bucks that had a unique antler characteristic. Would be seen or killed in the fall miles away.

Some of this was probably rut related. But not all of it cause some of the sightings and kills occurred late September early October.

Like Dan says "always" don't apply to mature bucks. Some are nomads and just cover way more ground.

Then again some are very reclusive and are very good at hiding their existence.
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Re: Ghost bucks

Unread postby Buck_shooter » Wed Jun 07, 2017 3:35 am

Anything is possible, I'm a firm believer that each deer is an individual and there are no "always" rules. After talking with the first guy he was pretty confident that buck spent most of his time in that area. I don't know for sure what led him to believe that but I know it was on a several thousand acre piece of land that he scouts, hunts and guides on. He seems to feel that no matter how careful he was with scent while setting cameras that buck would know he was there and avoid the camera at all costs day or night. It is always possible that it was a one time thing where he was just passing through but it's also possible he's right there most of the time. That's what I find fascinating about deer, no matter how much you learn you will never have them all figured out.
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Re: Ghost bucks

Unread postby <DK> » Wed Jun 07, 2017 4:48 am

headgear wrote:Just from what you are describing I don't know that the bucks spend a lot of time where these people are hunting, if a giant shows up out of the blue and is never seen again it could just be a random thing. With the second buck it could be seasonal, he might live somewhere else but spend in the winter in their area after hunting season has ended and then head back to his home range in the spring. These are just purely guesses on my part, they could be living right under their noses and just really good at avoiding hunters. Deer also have huge home ranges and they are not easy to kill if you are hunting a tiny section of land, even a square mile is not enough somtimes.

I agree w Headgear on this, those are some great guesses.

Buck_shooter wrote:Anything is possible, I'm a firm believer that each deer is an individual and there are no "always" rules. After talking with the first guy he was pretty confident that buck spent most of his time in that area. I don't know for sure what led him to believe that but I know it was on a several thousand acre piece of land that he scouts, hunts and guides on. He seems to feel that no matter how careful he was with scent while setting cameras that buck would know he was there and avoid the camera at all costs day or night. It is always possible that it was a one time thing where he was just passing through but it's also possible he's right there most of the time. That's what I find fascinating about deer, no matter how much you learn you will never have them all figured out.


I try to keep the same mindset but some of the biggest antlers iv seen died of age/unknown or velvet/summer pics only never to be seen again. The biggest deer iv ever seen personally was double drop tine, seen twice, in summer, in velvet, in retired persons front yard. Nobody I talk to ever heard of anyone killing him, no pics, no other stories of sightings... Iv looked through record book pics to double check and nothing...
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Re: Ghost bucks

Unread postby Wlog » Wed Jun 07, 2017 5:11 am

Buck_shooter wrote:Anything is possible, I'm a firm believer that each deer is an individual and there are no "always" rules. After talking with the first guy he was pretty confident that buck spent most of his time in that area. I don't know for sure what led him to believe that but I know it was on a several thousand acre piece of land that he scouts, hunts and guides on. He seems to feel that no matter how careful he was with scent while setting cameras that buck would know he was there and avoid the camera at all costs day or night. It is always possible that it was a one time thing where he was just passing through but it's also possible he's right there most of the time. That's what I find fascinating about deer, no matter how much you learn you will never have them all figured out.


I have no way of knowing this for sure, just an assumption, but sounds like a classic example of being to intrusive with trail cameras. Checking them too much or having them too close to bedding. Not saying you can't put a camera near bedding but you can't check it all the time if it is.

Again I don't know the guy or the whole scenario just my Opinion based off the description.
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Re: Ghost bucks

Unread postby Tennhunter3 » Wed Jun 07, 2017 6:08 am

Some Ghost bucks are amazing at avoiding cameras on propertys.Might pop up 1-2 times a year. Alot of deer go on travel periods during a time period every year while some stay on 50 acres their entire life. Deer are very much like humans i think that some never leave their hometown others travel the globe.

Ghost bucks i think move just some have odd cycles of movement. Ive heard alot of storys of bucks moving at midday outside the rut.Staying bedded mornings and evenings so they seem nocturnal.

Most bucks i think have routines just like himans do. Sure hunting pressure and other variables effect this. But the Ghost bucks everyday routine is very different from most bucks patterns. Ive seen alot of nice bucks between 10am and 2pm.
Last edited by Tennhunter3 on Wed Jun 07, 2017 6:12 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Ghost bucks

Unread postby stash59 » Wed Jun 07, 2017 6:10 am

Darkknight54 wrote:
headgear wrote:Just from what you are describing I don't know that the bucks spend a lot of time where these people are hunting, if a giant shows up out of the blue and is never seen again it could just be a random thing. With the second buck it could be seasonal, he might live somewhere else but spend in the winter in their area after hunting season has ended and then head back to his home range in the spring. These are just purely guesses on my part, they could be living right under their noses and just really good at avoiding hunters. Deer also have huge home ranges and they are not easy to kill if you are hunting a tiny section of land, even a square mile is not enough somtimes.

I agree w Headgear on this, those are some great guesses.

Buck_shooter wrote:Anything is possible, I'm a firm believer that each deer is an individual and there are no "always" rules. After talking with the first guy he was pretty confident that buck spent most of his time in that area. I don't know for sure what led him to believe that but I know it was on a several thousand acre piece of land that he scouts, hunts and guides on. He seems to feel that no matter how careful he was with scent while setting cameras that buck would know he was there and avoid the camera at all costs day or night. It is always possible that it was a one time thing where he was just passing through but it's also possible he's right there most of the time. That's what I find fascinating about deer, no matter how much you learn you will never have them all figured out.


I try to keep the same mindset but some of the biggest antlers iv seen died of age/unknown or velvet/summer pics only never to be seen again. The biggest deer iv ever seen personally was double drop tine, seen twice, in summer, in velvet, in retired persons front yard. Nobody I talk to ever heard of anyone killing him, no pics, no other stories of sightings... Iv looked through record book pics to double check and nothing...


A few big bucks get hit by cars even in the summer. Alot of these you don't hear about. If the car owner doesn't hunt. Or even the officer writing the report. Some just go straight to the dump. Their soft velvet racks get torn and broken up. So they rarely even make it to a taxidermist, let alone a record book. Even if a hunter is involved.

One summer while I was in my 20's. The work crew drove early every workday morning on the same stretch of highway. We often saw a great buck bedded on a field edge a couple hundred yards off the highway. One Monday morning there was a bloody spot on the road from an obvious deer/vehicle collision. Never saw the buck again.

2 years later ended up meeting the officer that ran that stretch. He said that yeah a good one got hit there a couple years ago, and another a couple years earlier very near to that one.
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Re: Ghost bucks

Unread postby Boogieman1 » Wed Jun 07, 2017 5:46 pm

I read a article awhile back that talked about how a young buck is forced out of his home range and develops his new area sometimes miles away. Periodically as the buck ages he takes trips back to his birth area. Sometimes when he's wounded badly and knows he is gonna die he returns to his original home. Whether there is much science behind this I don't know but it made for a good read. Wish I could remember who wrote the article
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