Why are Mature Buck so hard to kill

[Edcyclopedia]

% or ratio available in a given area...

[Rubline]

I think they are hard to kill because they wait till its dark. They learn it is safe after dark.
Now Yes during the "Breeding part of the Rut" there is daylight movement, but for the
majority of the time, they learn to associate hunters with daylight.

I agree with Stanley's point of older bucks being lazy. They use the other deer to their
advantage, letting all the doe family units go first, then the coast is clear...
Why burn valuable energy when there is no need to...

[mheichelbech]

I wonder if there are more 4, 5 and 6 year old does and if they behave in similar ways to similar age bucks.

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[bowkill00]

Good post. Their lazy. I honestly think that's why their so hard to kill. Whether lazy attributes to being smart....or vise versa...idk. we've killed alot of mature deer on drives. Very few any other way. We "make'm" get on their feet.

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[PK_]

I have found personally that a double lunged mature buck falls about as quick as any other deer does...

[Zona]

If laziness is directly proportional to intelligence, my brother in law is a freaking genius.

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[UofLbowhunter]

I kinda thinks its both. I think older bucks are alil bit more lazy , but i also think they are smart enough to know to bed close to food,water, and be closer to does so they can be more lazy than other younger bucks. Good post like to see more thoughts on this!

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[KLEMZ]

I am 57 years old and I do not move around anywhere near as much as I used to! When I was 30 years old I had "6 pack abs"....I don't anymore. I assure you it is NOT because I have become "lazy". It is a biological fact of becoming older. When you are older, it physically hurts to move after a period of sitting still. To put it in perspective for the young guys out there...remember when you started that intense workout routine and jolted your muscles into reality? Remember the pain you felt in your muscles for several days after? That is very close to how it feels to be old....every single day!

I don't want to be a "downer", but I wanted to put a little real life perspective on why it might be hard to kill a mature buck. They just don't move as much as the young bucks! They have dialed in a system of meeting their needs without having to suffer the "pain" of moving. They move less! We need to get close!!

[Mario]

Great topic...

Like all creatures in the kingdom Animalia I think there is programmed instincts that are based on survival. Certain behaviors are going to be performed just to meet an animals basic needs.

That being said I would say almost any animal can be "taught" or "conditioned" to do something under the right environment.

I think instinctively human scent, or human presence are seen as a threat. The majority of the interaction deer have with their environment is without human interaction. We are not walking among them day after day. If you do, like in the walking part by my house, the deer learn to tolerate your presence, even close presence.

If I am a mile back in a swamp, how often does a deer encounter a human?? I think instincts kick in and they run do to their fight or flight mechanism.

I think if you lived in the swamp, like literally lived in the swamp day after day the deer would likely grow tolerant to your presence.

Kind of like the guy who made friends with the Alaskan Grizzly bears.... but wait he got eaten

[JoeRE]

I think mature bucks are so hard to kill, because there aren't as many running around, that's my number 1.

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I think that hits the nail on the head.

Its doubly true because the less of them there are around, the harder they have to work to survive and that makes the few that do exist even harder to kill.

[mainebowhunter]

I think mature bucks are so hard to kill, because there aren't as many running around, that's my number 1.

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I think that hits the nail on the head.

Its doubly true because the less of them there are around, the harder they have to work to survive and that makes the few that do exist even harder to kill.

Mentioned it before. Last season, I got 100s and 100s of pics of an 8pt 2.5yr old. Daylight after daylight. Even during hunting season. Never saw that buck from stand. Saw his friends, but never him. Was not planning on shooting him. Just thought it was interesting because my not seeing him had nothing to do with being smart or elusive. It was just the game of odds. Older bucks I saw. Other 2.5 I saw.

Most times, any ONE deer you put your mind to killing can be super tough.

To expand on the unpredicatability a bit more. I watch deer every season moving mile over here...mile over there. On daylight .75 miles away in daylight one week. Next week, daylight .75 miles in another direction. Even sometimes the next day. Some are more predictable. Was out tonight on a piece of ground hanging cameras on some apple trees. Each tree had same size pellets, same clumps. I believe its the same 4.5yr old buck that I saw month ago. This buck is very predictable. Almost killed him last year. Hope he runs same area, uses same beds as last year. At this point, I think he is. I believe he is very killable. Time will tell. BUT he moves totally different than other bucks I am hunting 20 miles in another direction.

What I find very interesting is that the bucks that seem to move the MOST in my areas are the urban bucks. Many times, it comes back to the same thing, lack of 3.5yr olds in an area. This season, I abandoned ship and moved to a brand new piece. The camera pulls so far this season, no different. 3 known shooters in 2000 acres of timber...tough odds. So far, very unpredictable. Season opens Sept 10 and I am still looking for the chink in the armor.

I would not have it any other way. If it becomes easy, I will put my bow down and take up ballet

[cbay]

Most likely its a bit of both. They are mature because of their reclusive nature, the curious, bold ones get killed faster. At the same time if we agree that a 2.5 yr old is a bit more savvy than a yearling, then it follows that a 4.5 yr old could be more savvy than the 2.5 yr old. Any behavior observed during the rut can be discarded as regards to intelligence IMO. Its like being in a bar at 1am on Saturday night. Those(us) guys in there are likely to do some dumb stuff that is out of character. That's how I think of bucks during the rut. Don't see many dead bucks in the road outside of the rut...

I agree. I guess i'm the odd man out here for the most part because in my mind they are too good at evading as they get older, tolerate less, and are more careful.
The way i look at the life of those bucks is every moment something wants to kill them and they behave accordingly.
If it weren't for the rut,,,

[Bucky]

There just simply are not a lot of 4.5+

Between 4.5-6.5 most bucks for whatever reason are very cautious moving in daylight. My other thought is that dominant bucks tend to be where there is "easy" breeding... they stay where human presences is minimal, cover is thick, doe groups like to be. They almost sometimes disappear. Then, again IMO at 7.5 or 8.5 they loose dominance and breeding rights and end up in areas again where they are vulnerable and tend to move more for feeding opportunities. I know that is the one thing that will get an older human up/out and moving... the promise of a good meal .
These are just my observations.... 5 and 6 year old deer are tuff to kill

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[kurt]

There is not a lot of them and the ones that do make it are already doing something right otherwise they would be dead already

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[BigCedarJack]

Even though I think deer are not super "intelligent". Beyond good survival instincts animals can be conditioned/trained to do one thing or another. They are certainly not all equal at how fast they learn or how tricky they can be. I'd think deer are the same as dogs, cows, and horses (the animals I have experience with) in this respect. I know for fact they quickly pattern my dad. They know what time he gets home from work. Which truck is his, before I can hear it. They know which way he needs to walk to go towards the feed. Etc... I don't see why bucks can't pattern hunters as well. The older they get, the better they would be at this...

Some guys mentioned the pain of moving and the increased cautiousness coming with age. Another thing I'd throw in as I get older is the appreciation of rest and cool temps. I'm not nearly as in a hurry as I used to be either. I have more patience, I don't mind to be last in the food line, etc. I think Stanley? once said that he thought that the temperatures caused by the sun/weather has for more effect on deer than the moon.

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