determining good bedding

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Jeff25
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determining good bedding

Unread postby Jeff25 » Tue Apr 12, 2016 1:08 pm

So reading through lockdowns "wheres the buck" thread i noticed that he found quite a few beds, but i also noticed they seem to be passing off some of the bedding areas as low quality. my question is, how do you determine a good bedding area from a not so good bedding area? what are the key factors that make you believe one bedding area gives you higher odds vs another?


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Re: determining good bedding

Unread postby Mibowfreak » Tue Apr 12, 2016 2:08 pm

The kind of cover around it, how the buck uses the entry and exit routes, and how he uses wind/thermals to his advantage. But I would say how secure the bed is, is #1 for me.

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Re: determining good bedding

Unread postby Lockdown » Tue Apr 12, 2016 2:11 pm

Great question and one I struggle with myself.


One thing that really gets me excited is finding a concentration of new, old, and very old rubs near the bed, in the staging area, on a rubline, or any combination of the three. I have one bedding area (my best one) where its very easy to see the age differences. There's new rubs, yr old, two year old, on up to trees that look like they got rubbed 6 or 7 years ago. All that's noticeable is a vertical "scar" at rub height where the bark doesn't quite match the rest of the tree.


When I posted the aerial of my actual findings in that thread, I had two buck bedding areas marked. Neither one had much for rubs, but I knew to expect that due to low buck density in that area. They were the only two spots on the entire property that had [glow=red]old and new[/glow] rubs in the bedding/staging. One had an old and new rub on the vine IN the bed, and two new rubs 50 yards away facing away from bedding.

The other had 5 old rubs within arms reach of the bed. They looked to be 2-3 years old. The next rub was 30-40 yards away and there was a couple more in another 30 yards or so. However there was hair in the bed and it was a spot I marked before I set foot on the property. I walked for close to an hour before finding a single rub, so when you find old and new in the same spot, that's something you should key on IMO. Each element is like a +1 on how good it is. Its almost like a buck bed calculator. Hope you guys like this analogy :lol:

There's hair in the bed +1
recent rubs +1
old rubs +1
really old rubs +1
there are no other stands nearby +1
scrapes in the staging +1
large poop +1
you already had the location picked out as suspected bedding on an aerial +1
bed is worn to the dirt +1
it's remote +1
you found a shed in or close to the bed +1
There's a definitive rubline leaving the bed +1

And so on. The more things it has going for it, the better it is IMO.
Last edited by Lockdown on Tue Apr 12, 2016 2:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: determining good bedding

Unread postby DaveT1963 » Tue Apr 12, 2016 2:25 pm

I agree with Lockdown... Every buck is different and a new learning experience. I kind of relate it to a football season... Each team is different. While the rules stay the same weakness and vulnerabilities exist in both there offense and defense. Our job is to study game film (ie sign) and identify and exploit those weaknesses.

What makes good buck bedding for one buck, and the sign he leaves can be totally different for the next one. Each buck must be studied as an individual while using the general rules.

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Re: determining good bedding

Unread postby mainebowhunter » Tue Apr 12, 2016 3:02 pm

Lockdown wrote:Great question and one I struggle with myself.


One thing that really gets me excited is finding a concentration of new, old, and very old rubs near the bed, in the staging area, on a rubline, or any combination of the three. I have one bedding area (my best one) where its very easy to see the age differences. There's new rubs, yr old, two year old, on up to trees that look like they got rubbed 6 or 7 years ago. All that's noticeable is a vertical "scar" at rub height where the bark doesn't quite match the rest of the tree.


When I posted the aerial of my actual findings in that thread, I had two buck bedding areas marked. Neither one had much for rubs, but I knew to expect that due to low buck density in that area. They were the only two spots on the entire property that had [glow=red]old and new[/glow] rubs in the bedding/staging. One had an old and new rub on the vine IN the bed, and two new rubs 50 yards away facing away from bedding.

The other had 5 old rubs within arms reach of the bed. They looked to be 2-3 years old. The next rub was 30-40 yards away and there was a couple more in another 30 yards or so. However there was hair in the bed and it was a spot I marked before I set foot on the property. I walked for close to an hour before finding a single rub, so when you find old and new in the same spot, that's something you should key on IMO. Each element is like a +1 on how good it is. Its almost like a buck bed calculator. Hope you guys like this analogy :lol:

There's hair in the bed +1
recent rubs +1
old rubs +1
really old rubs +1
there are no other stands nearby +1
scrapes in the staging +1
large poop +1
you already had the location picked out as suspected bedding on an aerial +1
bed is worn to the dirt +1
it's remote +1
you found a shed in or close to the bed +1
There's a definitive rubline leaving the bed +1

And so on. The more things it has going for it, the better it is IMO.


Great analogy. Thats how I would answer the question. I find beds that I mark on my gps...just because they are beds with hair in them. BUT they don't have all the above mentioned stuff as part of them. It really comes down to reading and interpreting sign. And much of the "interpreting" is an educated guess.

Take for instance, I marked a bed. One big bed on a hummock. Rubs in and around the bed. 40yds from the bed is a big ground scrape...leaving the ground scrape is a pounded run...20 yds from the ground scrape is another better run with a rubline that crosses a brook and deer are following the top edge contour of a ravine. within 100yds of those runs are 3 more runs, coming off funneled land points, the land points are littered with old rubs and new rubs.

+1 +1 +1 ...things just start adding up.

I also have other beds that hold big bucks...that do not have nearly the sign in and around them. But from experience, I know big deer use them. As Dave said, nothing is created equal. Each spot is different...every deer is different. Some areas, you know the bucks bed there but you would be hard pressed to find well worn to the dirt beds. But if you look closely, you will find multiple beds within a small area.
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Re: determining good bedding

Unread postby JoeRE » Thu Apr 14, 2016 12:09 am

So I just posted this in the bed indicators thread but its aplicable here too:

This is probably a little different than the intent of the question but I think its really important. A big indicator I look for is observing an older buck morning and evening and where he is coming from or going to. There are beds all over the place in these hills and sometimes to tell what is preferred bedding for the biggest buck, you have to see him going somewhere, on cam, by glassing, or the like.

Any time I get a good buck on cam (outside of the rut anyway) or see one on stand my first thought is to pull out a map and look at the likely bedding I have marked in the area, figure out what he likely is using. A person starts doing that, and tracking past observations, and you will be surprised how apparent it becomes that older bucks favor certain spots year after year and younger bucks bed in a lot of spots you almost never will find an older buck. As was mentioned, a lot of older bucks don't leave much sign so in my opinion, using observations like that might be the most useful "bed indicator".


On top of that, other observations are really important to me. If there are big tracks in a bedding location, that's obviously something to take note of. Another thing that I have mentioned before, finding a good buck dead in its bed means something too. One of the best public land buck bedding locations I have found to date I only really paid attention to after finding two dead bucks in it on consecutive springs. I am confident NO ONE would pinpoint this bedding location w/o having found those bucks, its that hard to see. There are a handful of lightly used beds scattered along a ridge, that's it. Not much other sign - and plenty of other spots nearby that seem like they should be good as well, but they aren't in terms of holding big bucks.

A nice tall rub or two is a good sign too, ideally there are several years worth of nice tall rubs...that makes my nose start to twitch.

Other than that, for every big buck there is probably a dozen small bucks, maybe 50 in some areas, so it only makes sense that most of the buck bedding you find will be used by younger bucks.

I know this means it will take time to put things together, we all want to just hurry up, do some spring scouting and be set for the fall, but in my opinion it DOES often take years to pinpoint where the big boys hide. I can make a decent guess based on spring scouting, but if you let me observe and hunt a property a couple seasons I can get a lot more precise. No shortcuts. I know this doesn't fit into some situations if you are hunting out of state or do a lot of jumping into new areas, you just have to make the best of your situation.

I followed what is probably a pretty common trajectory in 2012 when I picked up Dan's Hill country and Swamp DVDs. I got fired up to find a bunch of buck bedding...and I did. I found so many single beds with a rub over them I would have to quit my job and get a divorce just to hunt them all. I realized pretty quickly I needed to thin down my prospects. Even earlier in my hunting career I had figured out mature bucks favor bedding in certain areas, but then after applying a lot of the concepts talked about in the DVDs, and really paying attention to observations like I mention above, my precision on big-buck-bedding went way up. Its a never ending process though, I am no expert, just want to know more next year than I do now and so on.
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Re: determining good bedding

Unread postby Kokes » Thu Apr 14, 2016 2:52 am

love the points system Lockdown..great way to breakdown a bedding area...just like a lot of beasts say, put all the pieces together...
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Re: determining good bedding

Unread postby mainebowhunter » Thu Apr 14, 2016 2:24 pm

JoeRE wrote:So I just posted this in the bed indicators thread but its aplicable here too:

This is probably a little different than the intent of the question but I think its really important. A big indicator I look for is observing an older buck morning and evening and where he is coming from or going to. There are beds all over the place in these hills and sometimes to tell what is preferred bedding for the biggest buck, you have to see him going somewhere, on cam, by glassing, or the like.

Any time I get a good buck on cam (outside of the rut anyway) or see one on stand my first thought is to pull out a map and look at the likely bedding I have marked in the area, figure out what he likely is using. A person starts doing that, and tracking past observations, and you will be surprised how apparent it becomes that older bucks favor certain spots year after year and younger bucks bed in a lot of spots you almost never will find an older buck. As was mentioned, a lot of older bucks don't leave much sign so in my opinion, using observations like that might be the most useful "bed indicator".


On top of that, other observations are really important to me. If there are big tracks in a bedding location, that's obviously something to take note of. Another thing that I have mentioned before, finding a good buck dead in its bed means something too. One of the best public land buck bedding locations I have found to date I only really paid attention to after finding two dead bucks in it on consecutive springs. I am confident NO ONE would pinpoint this bedding location w/o having found those bucks, its that hard to see. There are a handful of lightly used beds scattered along a ridge, that's it. Not much other sign - and plenty of other spots nearby that seem like they should be good as well, but they aren't in terms of holding big bucks.

A nice tall rub or two is a good sign too, ideally there are several years worth of nice tall rubs...that makes my nose start to twitch.

Other than that, for every big buck there is probably a dozen small bucks, maybe 50 in some areas, so it only makes sense that most of the buck bedding you find will be used by younger bucks.

I know this means it will take time to put things together, we all want to just hurry up, do some spring scouting and be set for the fall, but in my opinion it DOES often take years to pinpoint where the big boys hide. I can make a decent guess based on spring scouting, but if you let me observe and hunt a property a couple seasons I can get a lot more precise. No shortcuts. I know this doesn't fit into some situations if you are hunting out of state or do a lot of jumping into new areas, you just have to make the best of your situation.

I followed what is probably a pretty common trajectory in 2012 when I picked up Dan's Hill country and Swamp DVDs. I got fired up to find a bunch of buck bedding...and I did. I found so many single beds with a rub over them I would have to quit my job and get a divorce just to hunt them all. I realized pretty quickly I needed to thin down my prospects. Even earlier in my hunting career I had figured out mature bucks favor bedding in certain areas, but then after applying a lot of the concepts talked about in the DVDs, and really paying attention to observations like I mention above, my precision on big-buck-bedding went way up. Its a never ending process though, I am no expert, just want to know more next year than I do now and so on.


Good points Joe. I have been all about getting close to buck bedding areas for a few years now. But I realized, I needed to add more properties more than just depend on a few known bedding areas to produce. I started this process last year, adding more ground. This year, I added a LOT more new ground. 2015 was just flat out a lot more fun by hunting new areas. Just keep things fresh.
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Re: determining good bedding

Unread postby Mibowfreak » Thu Apr 14, 2016 11:49 pm

JoeRE wrote:So I just posted this in the bed indicators thread but its aplicable here too:

This is probably a little different than the intent of the question but I think its really important. A big indicator I look for is observing an older buck morning and evening and where he is coming from or going to. There are beds all over the place in these hills and sometimes to tell what is preferred bedding for the biggest buck, you have to see him going somewhere, on cam, by glassing, or the like.

Any time I get a good buck on cam (outside of the rut anyway) or see one on stand my first thought is to pull out a map and look at the likely bedding I have marked in the area, figure out what he likely is using. A person starts doing that, and tracking past observations, and you will be surprised how apparent it becomes that older bucks favor certain spots year after year and younger bucks bed in a lot of spots you almost never will find an older buck. As was mentioned, a lot of older bucks don't leave much sign so in my opinion, using observations like that might be the most useful "bed indicator".


On top of that, other observations are really important to me. If there are big tracks in a bedding location, that's obviously something to take note of. Another thing that I have mentioned before, finding a good buck dead in its bed means something too. One of the best public land buck bedding locations I have found to date I only really paid attention to after finding two dead bucks in it on consecutive springs. I am confident NO ONE would pinpoint this bedding location w/o having found those bucks, its that hard to see. There are a handful of lightly used beds scattered along a ridge, that's it. Not much other sign - and plenty of other spots nearby that seem like they should be good as well, but they aren't in terms of holding big bucks.

A nice tall rub or two is a good sign too, ideally there are several years worth of nice tall rubs...that makes my nose start to twitch.

Other than that, for every big buck there is probably a dozen small bucks, maybe 50 in some areas, so it only makes sense that most of the buck bedding you find will be used by younger bucks.

I know this means it will take time to put things together, we all want to just hurry up, do some spring scouting and be set for the fall, but in my opinion it DOES often take years to pinpoint where the big boys hide. I can make a decent guess based on spring scouting, but if you let me observe and hunt a property a couple seasons I can get a lot more precise. No shortcuts. I know this doesn't fit into some situations if you are hunting out of state or do a lot of jumping into new areas, you just have to make the best of your situation.

I followed what is probably a pretty common trajectory in 2012 when I picked up Dan's Hill country and Swamp DVDs. I got fired up to find a bunch of buck bedding...and I did. I found so many single beds with a rub over them I would have to quit my job and get a divorce just to hunt them all. I realized pretty quickly I needed to thin down my prospects. Even earlier in my hunting career I had figured out mature bucks favor bedding in certain areas, but then after applying a lot of the concepts talked about in the DVDs, and really paying attention to observations like I mention above, my precision on big-buck-bedding went way up. Its a never ending process though, I am no expert, just want to know more next year than I do now and so on.



Great points Joe.

This is something that I have been working on the last two years. Learning a property so well, that when you do have an encounter with a buck, or a trail camera picture, that you start putting the pieces to the puzzle together a little faster because you know the property so well.

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Re: determining good bedding

Unread postby gjs4 » Fri Apr 15, 2016 10:49 am

I struggle with it but just want to throw props to Lockdown and JoeRe for two great posts....taking a lot form those boys. :clap:
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Re: determining good bedding

Unread postby mainebowhunter » Fri Apr 15, 2016 11:50 am

Let me add some more to this thread. Yesterday, took a couple hours to walk an edge. Came across a bed. No biggie. See a lot of them. So kept poking along. Found another bed, than another bed. Starting to get a bit more interesting. Than I found some rubs. Not a ton. But a few. Marked the beds on my GPS. Decided to keep this area in mind. I have been scouting this piece for a couple weeks now.

So today, decided there is one more edge that I want to look at. Made my way to this edge, about .5 mile from where I found the beds. When I scouted today, I found a bunch of apple trees, even found a small shed. The apple trees and the area looked really good. Started finding rubs around the apples ...started finding a bunch. Scouted around and kept scouting the edge.

This is the point I wanted to make. Today, I was able to link up the rubs at the food source to the bedding area I found yesterday. What did not seem like much of a find yesterday, turned out to mean a whole lot more today. I followed rubs .5 mile back to the beds that I found yesterday. Its my guess, deer are traveling to the apples. All the rubs all pointed in the direction of travel to the beds. Observation and trail cams will better tell the story come July and August. But a bed that did not hold so much interest to me yesterday -- today I am much more interested in.
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Re: determining good bedding

Unread postby hunter10 » Fri Apr 15, 2016 10:55 pm

That is pretty neat main. It sounds like your area is large. On a smaller private farm with food in the field very close I often wonder if lack of sign from a bedding area outwards is because of this. Would give a false idea that no mature bucks are located here.

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Re: determining good bedding

Unread postby mainebowhunter » Fri Apr 15, 2016 11:22 pm

hunter10 wrote:That is pretty neat main. It sounds like your area is large. On a smaller private farm with food in the field very close I often wonder if lack of sign from a bedding area outwards is because of this. Would give a false idea that no mature bucks are located here.

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All depends on what you consider large. 1500 acres of timber where I am from, is not very big. And block, is split by a road. Across the road in both directions is more timber. Its why a lot of guys on here hunt and travel to hunt public ground. Deer move. You cannot scout all spring and put on miles of scouting on 2 50 acre pieces. They move a lot. Its nothing for them to bed .5 mile in either direction to where they are feeding. I believe its the #1 reason why guys keep getting nighttime pics at a food source. Rubs, scrapes, droppings and nighttime photos.

I do have bucks that bed 70yds from the food. But many times, that is not the case.

I will say, suburbia hunting, its a bit more challenging to find bedding. Deer bed in and around houses. They still might be traveling to get to a food source. But it could be across 2 roads and a golf course to get there.
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Re: determining good bedding

Unread postby DeerDylan » Sat Apr 16, 2016 1:29 am

gjs4 wrote:I struggle with it but just want to throw props to Lockdown and JoeRe for two great posts....taking a lot form those boys. :clap:


Same here. Good stuff!

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Re: determining good bedding

Unread postby Lockdown » Sat Apr 16, 2016 3:26 am

Great points Maine and Joe.

Maine's example of how he put the pieces together on that bedding area kind of made me smile. It's kind of like a 3 piece puzzle. The subtle but huntable bedding areas can be very hard to figure out until you have all three pieces. In his scenario, he had piece A (bedding that didn't look that great) piece C (food with rubs... he sees that all the time... nothing new) and it wasn't until piece B (rub line on the trail in between the two) that he had the AH-HA moment.


It's tough enough as it is, but low density and poor age structure areas make it even tougher to find bedding that is used consistently. I usually find bedding in the spots I mark on an aerial, but deciphering buck from doe bedding is the hard part. Especially when you have bucks rubbing and scraping in doe bedding during rut :lol: Keep in mind nobody is right all the time. Some guys on here make it look incredibly easy.


I had a couple times this year that I found rubs way away from suspected bedding. When I randomly came across them on the way in, I walked right by them thinking they were nothing. After I found the bedding and followed all the trails out, I got led right back to those rubs. I like to follow trails a long ways from bedding, [glow=red]especially[/glow] if there isn't much sign in the bedding/staging area. Even if there IS a lot of sign in there, where are they going after that? I often have ag fields in multiple directions... which one are they going to? I do think bucks will stage in one direction and do a 180 when they're ready to head out. So keep that in mind.


The "distant" rubs are very likely made during darkness, but who cares. A rub line is a rub line, and an important piece of the puzzle. Hunt it at the source. It might be 75-100 yards between rubs maybe more, and there might only be a couple.


Maine is talking about a rub line that runs a HALF MILE from bedding. Just think about that...

Maine what did that rub line look like from bedding to food? How many how often? Were most facing bed or food?


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