So lets talk about Michigan!!

Discuss deer hunting tactics, Deer behavior. Post your Hunting Stories, Pictures, and Questions/Answers.
  • Advertisement

HB Store


User avatar
Hawthorne
500 Club
Posts: 6228
Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2014 2:13 pm
Location: michigan
Status: Offline

Re: So lets talk about Michigan!!

Unread postby Hawthorne » Sun Feb 14, 2016 10:42 am

G3s wrote:OK, so as far as the single buck tag that some of the hunters would like to see in this state. In conversation shared with me by our QDMA president and secretary with DNR biologist Ashley Autenrieth, several NRC board members and MUCC boards members regarding the single buck tag, the term used was "that ship has sailed" It is deemed that only 4% of hunters fill their 2nd tag on a buck and that changing the tag system would cost far to much for no benefit. I am not saying I believe the 4% and I'm not saying I agree with the tag system we have now...but that is what came from the mouths of those that set the rules so to speak.
As far as expanded APR's it seems that the train is rolling and gaining steady pace at this point to get implementation in the rest of the lower peninsula...big difference would be that zone 3 would be a 4 point restriction as that is what it would take to protect the magic 50% of the yearling buck population. The NRC is now working on the deer management goals and setting up for our next deer management session that will cover the 3 years proceeding next season. I have been told the re-survey of the NW12 will take place following the next deer season so that it can be applied to the next deer management cycle. They do the deer management in 3 year cycles, not every season so a bit of advanced planning has to take place.
Off the record I know of one person with major clout in the rule makers that seems to think that APRS will take place across the whole of the lower peninsula inthe "very near future" take that statement for what it is worth...I am guessing that means they are going to try to push it through for this next management cycle, who knows for sure until we get there I suppose.

I like this conversation taking place here...it make sit really easy to see that passionate and educated deer hunters sure vary widely on what their singular preference would be. It makes it easier to see why our state seems to be so screwed up at times...think of all the lobbying the NRC members deal with from every group around the state from QDMA branches, to the SMART Hunter group (please dont get me started on those whack jobs), to Farm Bureau, ect...I think you get the point...we have 700K+ hunters in this state and a mountain of public hunting land and the NRC has to try to appease all groups in their management goals yet still accomplish the necessary biologic management at the same time....sounds like a pretty crappy situation and one of those you can't please everybody deals to me


That's great news you think its gonna pass. Im thinking the last vote they had was in 2014 when it got voted down so 2017 is the next vote? Are they still gonna send out ballots to random people and need a 66% majority to pass? I think the way they voted last time was shady. I signed the petition for the last one

[ Post made via Android ] Image


User avatar
Hawthorne
500 Club
Posts: 6228
Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2014 2:13 pm
Location: michigan
Status: Offline

Re: So lets talk about Michigan!!

Unread postby Hawthorne » Sun Feb 14, 2016 10:58 am

I use to keep up with it on Michigan sportsman. I very rarely visit there anymore usually just to look at the habitat threads. I give alot of credit to the lower Michigan deer management initiative for trying to pass it the last time. They have some good leaders

[ Post made via Android ] Image
User avatar
kenn1320
500 Club
Posts: 3474
Joined: Thu Mar 31, 2011 2:19 am
Location: Shooting my bow (MI)
Status: Offline

Re: So lets talk about Michigan!!

Unread postby kenn1320 » Sun Feb 14, 2016 3:29 pm

whitetailassasin wrote:
G3s wrote:OK, so as far as the single buck tag that some of the hunters would like to see in this state. In conversation shared with me by our QDMA president and secretary with DNR biologist Ashley Autenrieth, several NRC board members and MUCC boards members regarding the single buck tag, the term used was "that ship has sailed" It is deemed that only 4% of hunters fill their 2nd tag on a buck and that changing the tag system would cost far to much for no benefit. I am not saying I believe the 4% and I'm not saying I agree with the tag system we have now...but that is what came from the mouths of those that set the rules so to speak.
As far as expanded APR's it seems that the train is rolling and gaining steady pace at this point to get implementation in the rest of the lower peninsula...big difference would be that zone 3 would be a 4 point restriction as that is what it would take to protect the magic 50% of the yearling buck population. The NRC is now working on the deer management goals and setting up for our next deer management session that will cover the 3 years proceeding next season. I have been told the re-survey of the NW12 will take place following the next deer season so that it can be applied to the next deer management cycle. They do the deer management in 3 year cycles, not every season so a bit of advanced planning has to take place.
Off the record I know of one person with major clout in the rule makers that seems to think that APRS will take place across the whole of the lower peninsula inthe "very near future" take that statement for what it is worth...I am guessing that means they are going to try to push it through for this next management cycle, who knows for sure until we get there I suppose.

I like this conversation taking place here...it make sit really easy to see that passionate and educated deer hunters sure vary widely on what their singular preference would be. It makes it easier to see why our state seems to be so screwed up at times...think of all the lobbying the NRC members deal with from every group around the state from QDMA branches, to the SMART Hunter group (please dont get me started on those whack jobs), to Farm Bureau, ect...I think you get the point...we have 700K+ hunters in this state and a mountain of public hunting land and the NRC has to try to appease all groups in their management goals yet still accomplish the necessary biologic management at the same time....sounds like a pretty crappy situation and one of those you can't please everybody deals to me


:clap: great info here Tim! I also don't know about that second 4% buck kill rate either, but it's the fact you can use the extra tag on a doe with archery equipment, with an already expansive antlerless system.

[ Post made via iPhone ] Image



4% doesnt sound like much, but I believe I read that equates to an additional 23k bucks killed, which is a lot. They eliminated the doe archery option in the UP and pretty sure they were talking about it in the NLP. I always enjoyed that option for bow season, but in some areas the population doesnt appear to have been managed well enough to continue that. I also see them getting rid of it for monetary reasons. Why let a bow hunter only by a combo when you can charge them extra $$$ if they want to shoot a doe.

Tim your news about somebody with pull being in the right place for an Apr vote is encouraging. The anti apr guys however on MS have a different perspective. They said Christine (from Farmbureau) is now on the NRC board and Farmbureau is very outspoken about their negative view of aprs.

http://www.michigan.gov/dnr/0,4570,7-153-65134_65145-24723--,00.html
"Its about taking the right shot at the right time with good equipment." Dan Infalt
User avatar
G3s
500 Club
Posts: 1315
Joined: Mon Mar 15, 2010 3:58 am
Location: Northern Michigan
Status: Offline

Re: So lets talk about Michigan!!

Unread postby G3s » Mon Feb 15, 2016 1:10 am

That is very true Kenn..the Farm Bureau does have a person on the NRC now....fortunately her vote counts as one, so her perspective will be heard but wont be the single voice the directs where and how the deer management policies are formed and implemented...as far as the voice of those on MS....be careful what you listen to. If you listen to "Mr Whitepaper" I am sure you would think that the concerned sportsmen or SMART hunter groups have gained major traction and will be the driving force behind any new APR regulation and the dis-allowment of their implementation. There are a few guys over there that are in the know, but there are many guys over there that "think" they know or are very opinionated and feel that their opinion is the one that matters..there is a reason I very seldom post over there anymore, I am know where near a know it all on this subject but I am very fortunate to have some guys around me that are very well educated on this subject for me to glean information from. I will put up a post in the state forum when I hear new things or large discussions on this topic come up and what I learn. Most of what is being said right now is with a wink and a smile, nothing on record until some of the legal hoops are jumped through from what I understand.
mainebowhunter
500 Club
Posts: 3448
Joined: Fri Jan 15, 2016 10:45 am
Status: Offline

Re: So lets talk about Michigan!!

Unread postby mainebowhunter » Mon Feb 15, 2016 1:13 am

In some aspects...you Michiganders are light years ahead of us here in this state. Interesting in that one of our neighbors, VT, APRs really have not seemed to make much of a difference at all. PA seems to be doing much better with APRs.
User avatar
Hawthorne
500 Club
Posts: 6228
Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2014 2:13 pm
Location: michigan
Status: Offline

Re: So lets talk about Michigan!!

Unread postby Hawthorne » Mon Feb 15, 2016 1:17 am

I've never heard of SMART I've been out of the loop for awhile. I know very few guys that fill two buck tags at least in my circle. I've only done it maybe 5 times in 25 years of hunting.

[ Post made via Android ] Image
User avatar
G3s
500 Club
Posts: 1315
Joined: Mon Mar 15, 2010 3:58 am
Location: Northern Michigan
Status: Offline

Re: So lets talk about Michigan!!

Unread postby G3s » Mon Feb 15, 2016 1:25 am

Hawthorne wrote:I've never heard of SMART I've been out of the loop for awhile. I know very few guys that fill two buck tags at least in my circle. I've only done it maybe 5 times in 25 years of hunting.

[ Post made via Android ] Image

In my opinion you are not missing much by not knowing the SMART hunter group...look them up on facebook or google it. they are the armadillo/tinfoil helmet wearing type if you ask me.
I may be part of the problem on the 2nd buck tag. Most years I fill both of my buck tags. I wont go into detail on my opinion of the single buck tag system here...would make for some boring reading.
User avatar
G3s
500 Club
Posts: 1315
Joined: Mon Mar 15, 2010 3:58 am
Location: Northern Michigan
Status: Offline

Re: So lets talk about Michigan!!

Unread postby G3s » Mon Feb 15, 2016 1:29 am

mainebowhunter wrote:In some aspects...you Michiganders are light years ahead of us here in this state. Interesting in that one of our neighbors, VT, APRs really have not seemed to make much of a difference at all. PA seems to be doing much better with APRs.


In my opinion APRS have been fantastic for us here. I have hunted this area of Michigan for nearly 30 years, running a decent amount of cameras for the last 7 or 8 years and from personal experience the number of bucks and the age of those bucks has done nothing but increase in the past 3 years. 5 years ago I had to "hunt" all summer to find a target buck to chase during the fall. Now I have the chance to pick and choose what bucks I want to hunt from a fair number of them. This season I had 7 or 8 bucks that caught my interest. So from a pure hunting perspective...APR's are awesome!
User avatar
Hawthorne
500 Club
Posts: 6228
Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2014 2:13 pm
Location: michigan
Status: Offline

Re: So lets talk about Michigan!!

Unread postby Hawthorne » Mon Feb 15, 2016 1:32 am

I can only imagine what aprs could do for southern Michigan especially on public land where alot of the dinks are getting shot

[ Post made via Android ] Image
dirt nap giver
Posts: 2123
Joined: Wed Jun 16, 2010 2:29 pm
Location: SW Michigan
Status: Offline

Re: So lets talk about Michigan!!

Unread postby dirt nap giver » Mon Feb 15, 2016 1:57 am

G3s wrote:
mainebowhunter wrote:In some aspects...you Michiganders are light years ahead of us here in this state. Interesting in that one of our neighbors, VT, APRs really have not seemed to make much of a difference at all. PA seems to be doing much better with APRs.


In my opinion APRS have been fantastic for us here. I have hunted this area of Michigan for nearly 30 years, running a decent amount of cameras for the last 7 or 8 years and from personal experience the number of bucks and the age of those bucks has done nothing but increase in the past 3 years. 5 years ago I had to "hunt" all summer to find a target buck to chase during the fall. Now I have the chance to pick and choose what bucks I want to hunt from a fair number of them. This season I had 7 or 8 bucks that caught my interest. So from a pure hunting perspective...APR's are awesome!

This has my interest. I quit hunting up north because of the lack of mature bucks. If a Beast says things are much better up north, now I wil start to travel back up there. I know of some marshes that look like they would be the stereo type from the videos and each time I drove past them my thoughts would wander, but then my daydreams came back to reality of being up north.
I see a road trip in The APR zone in the near future.

[ Post made via iPhone ] Image
hard work trumps talent, when talent fails to work hard
User avatar
G3s
500 Club
Posts: 1315
Joined: Mon Mar 15, 2010 3:58 am
Location: Northern Michigan
Status: Offline

Re: So lets talk about Michigan!!

Unread postby G3s » Mon Feb 15, 2016 2:06 am

dirt nap giver wrote:
G3s wrote:
mainebowhunter wrote:In some aspects...you Michiganders are light years ahead of us here in this state. Interesting in that one of our neighbors, VT, APRs really have not seemed to make much of a difference at all. PA seems to be doing much better with APRs.


In my opinion APRS have been fantastic for us here. I have hunted this area of Michigan for nearly 30 years, running a decent amount of cameras for the last 7 or 8 years and from personal experience the number of bucks and the age of those bucks has done nothing but increase in the past 3 years. 5 years ago I had to "hunt" all summer to find a target buck to chase during the fall. Now I have the chance to pick and choose what bucks I want to hunt from a fair number of them. This season I had 7 or 8 bucks that caught my interest. So from a pure hunting perspective...APR's are awesome!

This has my interest. I quit hunting up north because of the lack of mature bucks. If a Beast says things are much better up north, now I wil start to travel back up there. I know of some marshes that look like they would be the stereo type from the videos and each time I drove past them my thoughts would wander, but then my daydreams came back to reality of being up north.
I see a road trip in The APR zone in the near future.

[ Post made via iPhone ] Image


When you have a few spare minutes log into facebook and go check out Tip of the Mitt QDMA page. Check out some of the deer that were taken this past season, it is really is remarkable
User avatar
whitetailassasin
Posts: 3404
Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2012 12:34 pm
Location: Michigan
Status: Offline

Re: So lets talk about Michigan!!

Unread postby whitetailassasin » Mon Feb 15, 2016 2:06 am

dirt nap giver wrote:
G3s wrote:
mainebowhunter wrote:In some aspects...you Michiganders are light years ahead of us here in this state. Interesting in that one of our neighbors, VT, APRs really have not seemed to make much of a difference at all. PA seems to be doing much better with APRs.


In my opinion APRS have been fantastic for us here. I have hunted this area of Michigan for nearly 30 years, running a decent amount of cameras for the last 7 or 8 years and from personal experience the number of bucks and the age of those bucks has done nothing but increase in the past 3 years. 5 years ago I had to "hunt" all summer to find a target buck to chase during the fall. Now I have the chance to pick and choose what bucks I want to hunt from a fair number of them. This season I had 7 or 8 bucks that caught my interest. So from a pure hunting perspective...APR's are awesome!

This has my interest. I quit hunting up north because of the lack of mature bucks. If a Beast says things are much better up north, now I wil start to travel back up there. I know of some marshes that look like they would be the stereo type from the videos and each time I drove past them my thoughts would wander, but then my daydreams came back to reality of being up north.
I see a road trip in The APR zone in the near future.

[ Post made via iPhone ] Image


Yes, last year was my first time back up north as well...will be back

[ Post made via iPhone ] Image
User avatar
Hawthorne
500 Club
Posts: 6228
Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2014 2:13 pm
Location: michigan
Status: Offline

Re: So lets talk about Michigan!!

Unread postby Hawthorne » Mon Feb 15, 2016 2:14 am

whitetailassasin wrote:
dirt nap giver wrote:
G3s wrote:
mainebowhunter wrote:In some aspects...you Michiganders are light years ahead of us here in this state. Interesting in that one of our neighbors, VT, APRs really have not seemed to make much of a difference at all. PA seems to be doing much better with APRs.


In my opinion APRS have been fantastic for us here. I have hunted this area of Michigan for nearly 30 years, running a decent amount of cameras for the last 7 or 8 years and from personal experience the number of bucks and the age of those bucks has done nothing but increase in the past 3 years. 5 years ago I had to "hunt" all summer to find a target buck to chase during the fall. Now I have the chance to pick and choose what bucks I want to hunt from a fair number of them. This season I had 7 or 8 bucks that caught my interest. So from a pure hunting perspective...APR's are awesome!

This has my interest. I quit hunting up north because of the lack of mature bucks. If a Beast says things are much better up north, now I wil start to travel back up there. I know of some marshes that look like they would be the stereo type from the videos and each time I drove past them my thoughts would wander, but then my daydreams came back to reality of being up north.
I see a road trip in The APR zone in the near future.

[ Post made via iPhone ] [img]http://www.thehuntingbeast.com/images/mobile/iPhone.png[/img

Yes, last year was my first time back up north as well...will be back

[ Post made via iPhone ] Image


Get the word out. Lol. I started seeing a flow of northern Michigan hunters looking for properties in southern Michigan starting 15-20 years ago.

[ Post made via Android ] Image
User avatar
kenn1320
500 Club
Posts: 3474
Joined: Thu Mar 31, 2011 2:19 am
Location: Shooting my bow (MI)
Status: Offline

Re: So lets talk about Michigan!!

Unread postby kenn1320 » Thu Feb 18, 2016 3:02 am

G3s wrote:That is very true Kenn..the Farm Bureau does have a person on the NRC now....fortunately her vote counts as one, so her perspective will be heard but wont be the single voice the directs where and how the deer management policies are formed and implemented...as far as the voice of those on MS....be careful what you listen to. If you listen to "Mr Whitepaper" I am sure you would think that the concerned sportsmen or SMART hunter groups have gained major traction and will be the driving force behind any new APR regulation and the dis-allowment of their implementation. There are a few guys over there that are in the know, but there are many guys over there that "think" they know or are very opinionated and feel that their opinion is the one that matters..there is a reason I very seldom post over there anymore, I am know where near a know it all on this subject but I am very fortunate to have some guys around me that are very well educated on this subject for me to glean information from. I will put up a post in the state forum when I hear new things or large discussions on this topic come up and what I learn. Most of what is being said right now is with a wink and a smile, nothing on record until some of the legal hoops are jumped through from what I understand.


Tim I don't spend much time on MS either, lots of the same stuff being rehashed by the same fly's. I appreciate the post by Mr Whitepaper, he has done some homework. I just don't sit on his side of any of the topics. Lol Im a Bio fanboy, and learned a lot from the lpdmi. Its frustrating to read on here some of the ideas and dreams. Its apperant to me many haven't heard of the lpdmi and therefore missed their message.

[ Post made via Android ] Image
"Its about taking the right shot at the right time with good equipment." Dan Infalt
User avatar
kenn1320
500 Club
Posts: 3474
Joined: Thu Mar 31, 2011 2:19 am
Location: Shooting my bow (MI)
Status: Offline

Re: So lets talk about Michigan!!

Unread postby kenn1320 » Thu Feb 18, 2016 3:10 am

mainebowhunter wrote:In some aspects...you Michiganders are light years ahead of us here in this state. Interesting in that one of our neighbors, VT, APRs really have not seemed to make much of a difference at all. PA seems to be doing much better with APRs.


APRs are typically only protecting a portion of deer. In Mi they are intended to advance a portion of 1.5yr Olds to 2.5yr Olds. Its really just shifting the harvest. In NY they tried them in 2 counties and didn't see a change. Its not possible in my opinion to not see a change unless people aren't following the rules. I believe deer were still being shot in those 2 counties and once in the truck, they were claimed to be shot in other counties. We have people in MI doing that, some being caught as evident by reading the mdnr weekly reports. With such a huge area like the NW12, enough honest hunters should offset those breaking the law.

[ Post made via Android ] Image
"Its about taking the right shot at the right time with good equipment." Dan Infalt


  • Advertisement

Return to “Deer Hunting”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: 100rollie, TrendictionBot and 48 guests