Killing the "Unkillables"

[oldrank]

Guys..Ive been dealing with a few situations where these bucks set up bullet proof beds. Examples.. Bedding on a refuge. Bedding in small low lying potholes where the wind swirls into it no matter the setup. Bedding in marshes where thermal switches kill me.. Ect ect.

One great example is a small bedding bowl on the edge of a small cattail marsh. To the east is a old field n a hill.. If the wind is from the west you would think its perfect but it hits the hill and pushes right back to the beds.. The thermals pull to the beds and a west wind blows to the beds. It seems like my setup is blown every time n my milkweeds float to the bed no matter what I do.

Does anyone have areas like this where you have had success? Ive tried moving closer n bump em.. If i move back I get em coming out but not far enough before its dark n I cant get a shot..

Anyone have scenarios where you just never could get on one in the perfect bed?

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[oldrank]

Thats a good idea. I have stacked certain spots before. Guess because of size of the area n how wet it is I never thought about blowing it out or if it was possible..

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[Wlog]

How about hunting him on a day with heavy enough winds to override the thermals?

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[Hawthorne]

Ever try it in the morning? Get in there early when the moon has him out feeding later in the morning. There's a small window in late October where bucks are getting to their beds late from checking does then their off out of their core areas bedding in rut staging areas or down wind of doe grouos in rut beds.Try to find where he enters and set up 2 hours before first light. All my nice bucks I've killed in the morning in these types of set ups.

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[Lockdown]

Good ideas by wlog and Hawthorne...

I was just typing up an a.m. hunt suggestion but Hawthorne beat me to it.

Might as well try and kill him before you bust him out of there. At least you have a chance.

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[oldrank]

Some how my south west wind bounces back to it. East wind blows to it. North wind bust me on my access.. I havent tried mornings.. Good ideas

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[TNstalker]

What bout a light an variable wind or none. Would u thermal go up an away or could it still carry over? Other wise I'm like other bump to another bed or a morning moon is only way I see.

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[dan]

There are always going to be spots like that... Lets face it, thats exactly why a buck chooses them. In most cases its a matter of picking the exact tree, far enough back and the right wind you need. It sometimes takes waiting for the day the buck will move a little farther... Or as others have mentioned a morning hunt.

The ones I have a hard time with are usually patches of dogwood isolated in cattails, or some other treeless thick on thick type cover. Bumping them works, as does just getting in there and giving it a low odds hunt just to make sure he don't get a free ride. He will move after the hunt and now your back in the game.

[JoeRE]

Yea I agree there will be some that are pretty much impossible to get set up on close enough. Some good ideas floated already.

The one thing I would add, and I have had more success with this than any other after a tough deer, is just wait till I can go after him with a gun. Some won't want to use a gun and that's fine but if the buck is still bedding in a location at a time of year when you can use a firearm - rifle, muzzleloader whatever - you can get him much easier. Either pick him off from a distance or in thick cover, like some of the stuff you mention, might take a nudge with a couple other people and knowing his escape routes well. Its not at all random how a buck will escape from primary bedding. He is going to have one or two preferred routes depending on conditions.

Bucks in sanctuaries just don't offer many options at all. Most of the time I move on.

[PK_]

Yea I agree there will be some that are pretty much impossible to get set up on close enough. Some good ideas floated already.

The one thing I would add, and I have had more success with this than any other after a tough deer, is just wait till I can go after him with a gun. Some won't want to use a gun and that's fine but if the buck is still bedding in a location at a time of year when you can use a firearm - rifle, muzzleloader whatever - you can get him much easier. Either pick him off from a distance or in thick cover, like some of the stuff you mention, [glow=red]might take a nudge with a couple other people and knowing his escape routes well. Its not at all random how a buck will escape from primary bedding. He is going to have one or two preferred routes depending on conditions.[/glow]

Bucks in sanctuaries just don't offer many options at all. Most of the time I move on.

My thoughts exactly. I don't waste my time hunting low odds setups, especially with bow. Even the most 'bullet proof' beds are usually not much of a match for a small precise push.

[Ridgerunner7]

I agree with some of the ideas above. Gentle pushes with bow or gun are worth a try. I would want to be very familiar with the escape routes ideally from experience but some can be predicted if you're experienced enough. I would try to replicate push and conditions (wind) and set up accordingly.

Like Dan mentioned it might come down to the exact tree for it to work. So many variables!

I've had luck using inclement weather (rains, high winds) to get into sensitive areas I otherwise wouldn't be able to. Often the heavy rains or winds will override your falling evening thermals. I did this exact set up this year on Oct 12. No way I could've pulled it off without the windy conditions. Sneaking in close for an ambush set up would be my first choice..maybe even spot and stalk if I was really running out of options or time.

Also worth mentioning, there are usually short windows of opportunity that open up during the season. Often it's just a day or two or maybe a couple times the entire season when the buck will move far enough away from his (perfect bedding) bedding for you to capitalize. Sitting in observation stands and being patient can provide you this information (if he's visible) and when you see a weakness in his route, move in immediately for the kill. Many of my bucks have been killed this way. Often it's a big drop in temps that stimulate the movement. It could be a couple early estrous does in the area. Moon influence is another possibility and certainly something you should be considering. I also use past history (sightings, trail cam data,) to predict when a certain buck will show up in an area I can hunt him more effectively and focus my efforts in that brief timeframe.

Another tactic worth mentioning if applicable is finding a primary scrape near his security cover and timing your hunt perfrect. My choice in your situation would be a morning hunt (rising thermals) following a night time rain front after it clears. I would want Oct 25-Nov 4 ideally with below normal temps. This situation is pretty specific but everything about this situation is in the favor of the hunter that knows his area well and stays out of the perfect spot until the absolute best time. I look for these exact conditions every year for one particular primary scrape area I hunt and I've killed two good bucks out of them. It also plays into the buck's natural instinct to check scrapes after a rain compounded by cold temps and daily increased moveent of the late oct/early nov pre rut behavior. If nothing else this is an example of several factors that begin to line up in the hunters favor offering a very good time to capitalize.

Although it wouldn't be my first choice, I've killed two large bucks over a decoy. There bedding was very solid and I set the decoy up out in the open away from the security cover where although visible to the buck, was safe for me as the hunter. I timed my hunt for optimal movement and let the hunt unfold. Does'nt alway work by any means but it has twice for me in limited attempts.

I forgot to add...bedding on in a sanctuary is tough. Determining when he enters the area you can hunt, if at all would be the key and timing it right.

I also agree not getting hung up on one buck in difficult bedding. Always have multiple back up plans for other bucks and other areas.

[Kraftd]

What about calling from far enough away to beat the thermals? I know RR mentioned a decoy, but similar theory. I don't have near the bed hunting experience or success of most of you, but generally have pretty good success calling in a wide array of situations.

Some light early season sparring or light grunting before the army is out crashing horns and playing a grunt tube like a trumpet every 15 minutes could be worth a shot too. Is it Arrowbender who uses this approach quite a bit?

This year I heard a buck get up in a cedar swamp bed that sounded like it was heading away and with the wind just off for the bed from my tree, gave him three soft grunts and then heard him rake his antlers and basically come right in. He ended up hanging up in thick nasty stuff for 20 minutes at 15 yards and I never got a shot, but in principal it worked. I think he got nervous when he didn't see that other buck, so maybe a decoy and some calling?

[Ridgerunner7]

What about calling from far enough away to beat the thermals? I know RR mentioned a decoy, but similar theory. I don't have near the bed hunting experience or success of most of you, but generally have pretty good success calling in a wide array of situations.

Some light early season sparring or light grunting before the army is out crashing horns and playing a grunt tube like a trumpet every 15 minutes could be worth a shot too. Is it Arrowbender who uses this approach quite a bit?

This year I heard a buck get up in a cedar swamp bed that sounded like it was heading away and with the wind just off for the bed from my tree, gave him three soft grunts and then heard him rake his antlers and basically come right in. He ended up hanging up in thick nasty stuff for 20 minutes at 15 yards and I never got a shot, but in principal it worked. I think he got nervous when he didn't see that other buck, so maybe a decoy and some calling?

Under normal circumstances this would be a valid tactic. Where Old Rank is talking about it's extremely high pressure which wouldn't be the best circumstance for calling or decoy use. Very difficult to avoid hunters if not impossible and most of them are cranking on grunt tubes and rattle bags every day of the season. In a lower pressure situation under the right conditions, absolutely. As with all mature deer, a lot of things need to be thought out before calling to him. (can he see where the call is coming from, his likely approach (downwind) and will he be within range, amount of hunting pressure in the immediate area).

[oldrank]

Lots of good thought.. As RR7 said its very heavy pressure, Its crazy to think about but from my stand I can see a ground blind n 2 other treestands in the distance. I havent seen anyone hunt em but they r there.

I messed around with calling n had some success with it this yr.. But it would have to be a perfect situation. Most of my encounters at this spot end with the deer moving from the beds with no shooting light left.

It really may be a spot i have to leave until all the stars align.

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[oldrank]

I might put up a map show situation when i get home from work.