Ingredients for Hill Country Buck Beds

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checkerfred
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Ingredients for Hill Country Buck Beds

Unread postby checkerfred » Wed Dec 30, 2015 12:07 pm

I was talking with Dan about this and thought it would be a good topic.

dan wrote:
checkerfred wrote:Subject: DEER BED PICS

dan wrote:
checkerfred wrote:So I've been trying to find beds in hill country. It's been tough only finding one for sure buck bed which was a small buck by the size, and I did find 2-3 areas with doe beds. I did find one bed the other day on a point but it was further down the point than what I thought a buck would bed, and again wasn't huge...maybe small buck big doe...no rubs around. It was hard to see but I did find hair. So how do you know for sure if some areas are beds? I've seen grassy areas with spots where the grass was much much lower than other areas but no hair. So is hair the biggest indicator?

at the scouting workshop and during some private scouting trips for guys I have noticed outside of Wisconsin a lot of "hill country" is more rolling, and there is no defined "military crest". On rolling hills the beds often are not in the same spot every day, they actually most likely even move several times during the day. I know this because I know why they are bedded there. They want to smell both above and below at the same time... Wind speed, air pressure, temperature, sun location, speed of thermal rise, exact wind direction, etc. are all going to change exactly where the wind tunnel is on a rolling hill.

So, you need to determine which points they are bedding on, rather than the exact bed... Then determine how they get in and out of that hill, so you know where to ambush.


So how do you find those points? Just by hoping to find one bed then know they use that point? This is killing me lol

By the sign going in and out... For instance, when we did the Kentucky workshop I found one really great bedding area that had all the ingredients and was obviously a great spot, but there were other areas I thought were probably pretty good, but were less obvious. One was a ridge that dead ended into about three points that were rolling. The points had beds on them, but they were hard to see and scattered cause the points were rounded. But, where all the points came together you could see good entry trails with big rubs coming in... Thats right where I would be hunting. 100 to 200 yards from any of the beds, hunting all the fingers at once...

My suggestion would be if your unsure, throw a stand at it and see what happens...

If your in hill country its easy to scout cause 90% of the buck bedding is going to be at or around the same elevation and you only have to walk that elevation line... If you walk all of that elevation, you can be sure you have walked right thru the big buck beds. Knowing that makes it a little easier to hunt the areas that looked the best.


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checkerfred
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Re: Ingredients for Hill Country Buck Beds

Unread postby checkerfred » Wed Dec 30, 2015 12:11 pm

So my question is what are the right ingredients? I understand this can vary but there has to be some sort of general guide. For example when scouting by a topo map, what are some things you pick up on that make you want to check it out over any of the other hundreds of points in the hills.

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Re: Ingredients for Hill Country Buck Beds

Unread postby mauser06 » Wed Dec 30, 2015 1:15 pm

You'll immediately narrow your search down based on current wind direction...only so many points are going to work for the specific wind...

Bucks are typicslly going to bed on points with the actual wind blowing the direction of the point..the thermal rise and meet that wind creating the thermal tunnel at a specific elevation...


Have you watched the hill country DVD??? It really helps and illustrates what happens and why they bed on specific points...




I might not be right...might not fully understand what you mean...I apologize if so...



And...I have been in places where there are literally countless points in a small area...parts of Ohio and Illinois and Michigan come to mind...

I will admit in a situation like that where the land is basically like a bad case of acne with small knobs all over the place...I have no idea how your determine one to be better than one right beside it..

I've only applied hill country to the hills of Pennsylvania... I run I to the opposite issue on a lot of places where there either isn't woods at the proper elevation or there just isn't a point around that works properly for the current wind...I see that a LOT and am still scratching my head...

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Re: Ingredients for Hill Country Buck Beds

Unread postby checkerfred » Wed Dec 30, 2015 1:56 pm

mauser06 wrote:You'll immediately narrow your search down based on current wind direction...only so many points are going to work for the specific wind...

Bucks are typicslly going to bed on points with the actual wind blowing the direction of the point..the thermal rise and meet that wind creating the thermal tunnel at a specific elevation...


Have you watched the hill country DVD??? It really helps and illustrates what happens and why they bed on specific points...




I might not be right...might not fully understand what you mean...I apologize if so...



And...I have been in places where there are literally countless points in a small area...parts of Ohio and Illinois and Michigan come to mind...

I will admit in a situation like that where the land is basically like a bad case of acne with small knobs all over the place...I have no idea how your determine one to be better than one right beside it..

I've only applied hill country to the hills of Pennsylvania... I run I to the opposite issue on a lot of places where there either isn't woods at the proper elevation or there just isn't a point around that works properly for the current wind...I see that a LOT and am still scratching my head...

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Got the dvd and have watched. I did know about eliminating the windward side. My question lies more in the fact that our land is sooo huge that I can find tons of leeward points. So what makes one better than the other for big bucks? There has to be some sort of common ground

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Re: Ingredients for Hill Country Buck Beds

Unread postby BigHunt » Wed Dec 30, 2015 2:14 pm

most buck beds I find are open in the front with thick back cover such as thorn bushes, blown downs, tree tops, huge rocks an just all around thick cover....

doe bedding is a lot thicker in general

as for finding "the point" you need to just put boots on the ground and scout every point to be sure....i find that the small side points that don't show up on a topo are the best for buck bedding. the big points are the obvious, look for small hidden side points



Here is a small branch if u want to call it.....the buck beds infrount of it .with wind to his back....the branch for back cover with
thermals in his face
[bbvideo=560,315]425,350https://youtu.be/GSVjRjTaZq0[/bbvideo]
Last edited by BigHunt on Wed Dec 30, 2015 2:28 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Ingredients for Hill Country Buck Beds

Unread postby Jphunter » Wed Dec 30, 2015 2:15 pm

Every scenario is different for different times of the season, and the ingredients are probably different for the type of hill country but there's a few things I look for. If I'm looking at an area that's has a lot of possible bedding points for the same wind.

I look at the points relation to food, water or doe staging depending on the time of season.

I try to find points with a steep drop off or a little spur. These are hard to see on a topo map some times. Three points could look the same on the map but scouting in person can uncover their differences.

I also look for good ground cover, blow downs, grassy knobs, vegetation transitions, something to give the deer security.

I'm sure there's more but these are some of the ingredients I look for.

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Re: Ingredients for Hill Country Buck Beds

Unread postby checkerfred » Wed Dec 30, 2015 3:02 pm

Thanks guys, those are some good things to keep in mind. I did find one bed on a point that didn't really show until I walked it. It wasn't a huge bed and seemed like it was a rut bed but was on a point exactly like that. I can now see it on the map but at the time it looked like just a small variation in the ridge. I've checked several close to the road and came up empty except for one area. Again, wasn't a huge bed. This place does hold big bucks as several big deer are killed each year.

As for points in relation to does, food, water...this is also tough. Does probably being the easier. The reason I say this is because in Alabama. there's usually some kind of food that's abundant all the way until the most bitter part of the season which would be late January. I've seen does feeding on acorns in early January before! Water is everywhere....creeks, drainages etc. Though I could see possibly finding big tracks in those areas. So I think finding the beds is the first major step, then questioning all of these things.
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Re: Ingredients for Hill Country Buck Beds

Unread postby checkerfred » Wed Dec 30, 2015 3:05 pm

BigHunt wrote:most buck beds I find are open in the front with thick back cover such as thorn bushes, blown downs, tree tops, huge rocks an just all around thick cover....

doe bedding is a lot thicker in general

as for finding "the point" you need to just put boots on the ground and scout every point to be sure....i find that the small side points that don't show up on a topo are the best for buck bedding. the big points are the obvious, look for small hidden side points



Here is a small branch if u want to call it.....the buck beds infrount of it .with wind to his back....the branch for back cover with
thermals in his face
[bbvideo=560,315]425,350https://youtu.be/GSVjRjTaZq0[/bbvideo]


Nice video BigHunt...thanks! The snow helps! Something we rarely get lol. You said the bed was right on the dropoff. It's hard to tell from the video but it looked more on top...so it was in the thermal tunnel and if you were to walk that 1/3 to 1/4 elevation you would run into it?
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Re: Ingredients for Hill Country Buck Beds

Unread postby Matt6506 » Wed Dec 30, 2015 6:22 pm

I find a lot here in Ohio on side hills, I have yet to find on directly on the end of a point. I also found several in areas where the deer are patterning the hunters, like my buck I killed this past Oct. He was bedding on a side hill above a rather active ATV trail, when I started searching for beds last winter/ spring I started at the highest elevation on a particular property found out at what elevation the thermal mixing zone is and walked that perimeter, must beds I found were up against a lay down, rock or thick cover on the back side and open on the front

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Re: Ingredients for Hill Country Buck Beds

Unread postby dan » Wed Dec 30, 2015 10:30 pm

Got the dvd and have watched. I did know about eliminating the windward side. My question lies more in the fact that our land is sooo huge that I can find tons of leeward points. So what makes one better than the other for big bucks? There has to be some sort of common ground

Thick above... Near food... Points in areas with little pressure, and lots of sign... Over looked areas... the points that are layed out real well for any wind except the rarest....

Mimic your scouting. When you find a great bedding area, look for areas that are just like that one in elevation, thickness, pressure, etc.
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Re: Ingredients for Hill Country Buck Beds

Unread postby BigHunt » Wed Dec 30, 2015 11:07 pm

checkerfred wrote:
BigHunt wrote:most buck beds I find are open in the front with thick back cover such as thorn bushes, blown downs, tree tops, huge rocks an just all around thick cover....

doe bedding is a lot thicker in general

as for finding "the point" you need to just put boots on the ground and scout every point to be sure....i find that the small side points that don't show up on a topo are the best for buck bedding. the big points are the obvious, look for small hidden side points



Here is a small branch if u want to call it.....the buck beds infrount of it .with wind to his back....the branch for back cover with
thermals in his face
[bbvideo=560,315]425,350https://youtu.be/GSVjRjTaZq0[/bbvideo]


Nice video BigHunt...thanks! The snow helps! Something we rarely get lol. You said the bed was right on the dropoff. It's hard to tell from the video but it looked more on top...so it was in the thermal tunnel and if you were to walk that 1/3 to 1/4 elevation you would run into it?


that's a good question.
the bed is about 10 yards from the main drop off of the ridge and about 30 yards from the hunters trail...I think smell from behind and sight is why this buck beds here with occasional thermals in his face, not all deer paly by the "rules"....when I sat in his bed I could easy see down into the valley if danger approached. ideal set up for him. I think he is set up waiting for danger to walk by then he bolts....ever time I've kicked a buck of this bed it was from behind :think:
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Re: Ingredients for Hill Country Buck Beds

Unread postby BigHunt » Wed Dec 30, 2015 11:16 pm

Matt6506 wrote:I find a lot here in Ohio on side hills, I have yet to find on directly on the end of a point. I also found several in areas where the deer are patterning the hunters, like my buck I killed this past Oct. He was bedding on a side hill above a rather active ATV trail, when I started searching for beds last winter/ spring I started at the highest elevation on a particular property found out at what elevation the thermal mixing zone is and walked that perimeter, must beds I found were up against a lay down, rock or thick cover on the back side and open on the front

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there's an old abounded farm house out in the middle of no where near my land in western wis (hill country). the buck beds right in the thick of it out in the middle of a field very far from the 1/3 elevation. no points, ridges, or side hills ..... ..I think that's complete opposite of "Hill country bedding" what it provides for him, is working....
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Re: Ingredients for Hill Country Buck Beds

Unread postby checkerfred » Wed Dec 30, 2015 11:32 pm

Ok some good points here. So now looking at a topo, how do you determine the best area, or at least a good area to start looking rather than walking miles and miles. I realize I'm gonna have to put mileage on my boots but I just wanna do it it higher percentage areas. So would I look for points offer multiple winds or points with other off wind point bedding nearby?

I'm hunting big woods so many times there's not a field nearby. It could be 5 or more miles before you hit private land where a field may be so pinpointing a food source by map seems hard to do.

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Re: Ingredients for Hill Country Buck Beds

Unread postby Southern Man » Thu Dec 31, 2015 1:33 am

checkerfred wrote:Ok some good points here. So now looking at a topo, how do you determine the best area, or at least a good area to start looking rather than walking miles and miles. I realize I'm gonna have to put mileage on my boots but I just wanna do it it higher percentage areas. So would I look for points offer multiple winds or points with other off wind point bedding nearby?

I'm hunting big woods so many times there's not a field nearby. It could be 5 or more miles before you hit private land where a field may be so pinpointing a food source by map seems hard to do.



Pick a spot and go. Ask yourself a few questions.
Where are the deer activity areas? - Deer will most probably not be evenly distributed throughout the woods.
What's the preferred foods? - If deer are there, food is there. Find the foods.
Where is the most pressure in the area? - Hunters also are not necessarily evenly scattered in the woods either. Find the spots others don't go.
How does the sign in the area relate to the questions above? Where are the travel corridors?

Looking at a topo is only a guide, not a for sure thing. Dan and others on here are able to pick high percentage spots for beds but I cannot. There is no substitute for walking the area. The workshop bed we found was on a small finger off the side of a ridge. The finger itself didn't really show up on the topo. I try to pick out the the biggest ridge in an area based on the most common winds. I mark potential spots, then dive in. Some areas look good, others don't. Some show things I wasn't able to see on topos or aireals.

If you're looking for beds like the ones shown in pics on this forum, lots of luck. Those are the best of the best. I still haven't located a bed that looks like those. Probably due to what Dan said above. On the day before the workshop, my intent was to take Dan to the top of the ridge to start. On the way up the ridge he found several spots that were bedding. I have seen spots like that over and over up there and not realized what they were because I was looking for the "perfect bed". I would almost guarantee you have done the same.
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Re: Ingredients for Hill Country Buck Beds

Unread postby Bowhunter4life » Thu Dec 31, 2015 12:42 pm

It's pretty much been covered as I read through some of it here but as southern man somewhat explained, if you are hunting some rolling hills then you can forget about finding the matted down beds. Doesn't happen. Lots of things to take into consideration when scouting for the buck beds. Most have been touched on already but don't just walk through the woods looking for that matter down bed, read the sign. When I say sign I'm not only talking about rubs and scrapes, often times it's something small. Scouting for beds here in the big timber you will find just the smallest of clues and you have to piece those together. I would say roughly 90 percent of the preferred buck bedding areas in this country I hunt which yes some do have crops but most areas of the public may not have a field for miles in any direction, there is little obvious sign near them. Tracks, droppings (pay attention to size), subtle sign like branches snapped by the bucks horns up kinda high or lower branches and twigs that have been browsed on tell the story. All these little things add up and is often what 99 percent of the hunters over look as they are searching for the big rubs and scrapes. If that sign lead to killing big buck there would be a lot more hunters with deer heads on their wall but the fact is often it doesn't!

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