Why or what causes deer to smell to its fullest ability?
-
- 500 Club
- Posts: 9756
- Joined: Wed Mar 16, 2011 11:28 am
- Location: Central WI
- Status: Offline
Why or what causes deer to smell to its fullest ability?
Deer appear to have different odor thresholds that cause alarm. While I am strongly under the contention that the strength of the scent significantly impacts response of a whitetail in a hunting situation, I'm also compelled to believe that whitetails only use their "super smell" when they feel pressured. In other words, a whitetail drops its defenses when predators aren't a threat and never "drink up" the predator scent. Similarly, whitetails accept some predator scent when associated with a positive stigma (e.g. foot plot).
Think about your experiences. What have you seen? When you were busted, did they freak out because of expectation? Have you ever gotten away with more in areas where deer would expect less human activity? Does the element of surprise (first sit) give you an advantage with the nose?
Think about your experiences. What have you seen? When you were busted, did they freak out because of expectation? Have you ever gotten away with more in areas where deer would expect less human activity? Does the element of surprise (first sit) give you an advantage with the nose?
- Stanley
- Honorary Moderator
- Posts: 18734
- Joined: Tue Aug 09, 2011 4:18 am
- Facebook: None
- Location: Iowa
- Status: Offline
Re: Why or what causes deer to smell to its fullest ability?
Great topic for discussion. I am not sure what triggers some bucks to be super elusive and other to not be. In 1994 I was hunting late season it was second to last day of the season. I had hunted all season long passing some nice bucks but nothing real big. I set up in a bottle neck with a North wind knowing the deer traffic was east/west.
About an hr into the hunt the wind switched to the west. I thought ok I'll stay here with a chance from the west. Not long after I hear a tractor coming from the North it was Bob the land owner. He has a trailer full of bricks and starts dumping them about 75 yards North of me. Just terrible noise and racket. I'm set up on the ground and am just about to the brink, if you know what I mean.
Bob gets done dumping and heads back to the barn (North). I'm setting there totally dejected, I know this hunt is a bust. I've lost my concentration and am madder than a hornet. I look to the East, Keep in mind the wind is blowing straight down the bottle neck West to East. A doe is running straight towards me. I grab my bow and try and figure out if the doe will go in front of me or in back.
Behind the doe is a booner buck (12 point) running full bore. As luck would have it the doe runs behind me. I get off my camp stool and do an about face. The doe keeps running the buck stops directly behind me at 5 yards. I'm at full draw but absolutely no shot. The buck is out of my scent stream and can't figure out what is going on. He then ran off after the doe.
Now I'm really bummed. I look to the East and here comes another buck (a solid 125 P&Y 8 point). This buck catches my scent and stops 25 yard from me. He doesn't want to leave the chase. I am at full draw with the pin on his vitals but couldn't drop the string. I was just to focused on the booner and was out of sorts. He circles around me I think trying to get out of my scent stream and the takes up the chase. I think this buck just wanted not to smell me.
I've asked myself many times did the booner not smell me? This was the first and only time I ever had a mature buck come at me with the wind blowing from me to him. The booner did have his tongue hanging out. Was he breathing through his mouth? I just don't know. Why did the booner not smell me and the other buck did? I ate my tag that year incidentally.
About an hr into the hunt the wind switched to the west. I thought ok I'll stay here with a chance from the west. Not long after I hear a tractor coming from the North it was Bob the land owner. He has a trailer full of bricks and starts dumping them about 75 yards North of me. Just terrible noise and racket. I'm set up on the ground and am just about to the brink, if you know what I mean.
Bob gets done dumping and heads back to the barn (North). I'm setting there totally dejected, I know this hunt is a bust. I've lost my concentration and am madder than a hornet. I look to the East, Keep in mind the wind is blowing straight down the bottle neck West to East. A doe is running straight towards me. I grab my bow and try and figure out if the doe will go in front of me or in back.
Behind the doe is a booner buck (12 point) running full bore. As luck would have it the doe runs behind me. I get off my camp stool and do an about face. The doe keeps running the buck stops directly behind me at 5 yards. I'm at full draw but absolutely no shot. The buck is out of my scent stream and can't figure out what is going on. He then ran off after the doe.
Now I'm really bummed. I look to the East and here comes another buck (a solid 125 P&Y 8 point). This buck catches my scent and stops 25 yard from me. He doesn't want to leave the chase. I am at full draw with the pin on his vitals but couldn't drop the string. I was just to focused on the booner and was out of sorts. He circles around me I think trying to get out of my scent stream and the takes up the chase. I think this buck just wanted not to smell me.
I've asked myself many times did the booner not smell me? This was the first and only time I ever had a mature buck come at me with the wind blowing from me to him. The booner did have his tongue hanging out. Was he breathing through his mouth? I just don't know. Why did the booner not smell me and the other buck did? I ate my tag that year incidentally.
You can fool some of the bucks, all of the time, and fool all of the bucks, some of the time, however you certainly can't fool all of the bucks, all of the time.
-
- Posts: 223
- Joined: Sat Mar 14, 2015 7:22 am
- Status: Offline
Re: Why or what causes deer to smell to its fullest ability?
I disagree I think they always have the same level of alertness. Now obviously you see them tune into u sometimes, but it think in the general day of a mature whitetail his anxiety level stay about the same, relatively low. They know nothing ever find them in there bed they can chill. And once they are moving you generally see a really relaxed animal until (boom), alert mode gets activated. He heard a wierd sound, smells you or your ground scent, etc. I believe they smell so well that they know how fresh scent is. They don't spook at coyote ground scent because they know it's not a threat. I don't really think they spook over our ground scent to much. I rarely see one get nervous at where I walked.. And I believe he knows that smell is a non threat. Now if you tromp up a bedding area that's different, but I'm talking about general stealthy sneak straight in straight out. I also usually get super busted only when I hunt on the ground. And I believe it's because they pick up on me as a nearby immediate threat, whereas 15+ ft seems to change that.. I know for a fact suburban deer do not fear humans walking by them at 20 yrds in a given spot where they expect them, however if you walk into a wood lot no one travels much , but hunts they will blow out in a hurry at the slightest scent.. And I mean in real obvious way, they are afraid of you at x location and could care less about you at y location. It's a very special kind of nose and I think ppl have to not think like ppl to understand. For example doe estrous, yes a curious buck may pay it some attention, but it does not draw rutting bucks in from downwind. However a buck knows when he crosses a estrous does track from an hour before and follows it. The difference is he can smell her on a level we can't imagine. He knows the second she ovulates! It hits him like a ton of bricks. I've watched this with my dogs, the female comes in heat, male doesn't care for a week or so( she's bleeding, swolen, raising her tail for him), nothing, all of a sudden it's all you can do to keep him away and he'll take down any barriers you put between them. And then as quick as it turned on he loses interest despite her continued interest in him, then she goes out...
Sorry I got to rambling, i can talk deer noses for hours.. But i think they are smelling us at such a molecular level it's hard to comprehend, and they don't have to try and focus to pic up this smells they just filter they until boom , something hits him that ain't right. And that's why I do think not human odors ( gas, food, coffee, whatever) will spook deer if they smell it where they've never smelled it before.
[ Post made via iPhone ]
Sorry I got to rambling, i can talk deer noses for hours.. But i think they are smelling us at such a molecular level it's hard to comprehend, and they don't have to try and focus to pic up this smells they just filter they until boom , something hits him that ain't right. And that's why I do think not human odors ( gas, food, coffee, whatever) will spook deer if they smell it where they've never smelled it before.
[ Post made via iPhone ]
-
- Posts: 223
- Joined: Sat Mar 14, 2015 7:22 am
- Status: Offline
Re: Why or what causes deer to smell to its fullest ability?
So to answer more directly I think he is using his super smell, but it's hard for our brains to regester what he smells. I.e. Pics up on some shredded skin cells from u, the coyote last night the 20 deer from last night, a coon, acorns, water, a squirrel upwind 100 yrds+ 200 more smells. But nothing to trigger a flight response. And this likely get deer killed many times. He can't run from every predatory smell he pics up or he'd never stop running he unconsciously cyphers through all the incoming data, until the system gets an alert. Some you will see it happen it goes from filtering smells to consciously looking, smelling, hearing everything around and reading it like a puzzle, and he knows something is not right. Which brings you to how much is required for a response vs. how much is required for flight?...
[ Post made via iPhone ]
[ Post made via iPhone ]
- Hawthorne
- 500 Club
- Posts: 6228
- Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2014 2:13 pm
- Location: michigan
- Status: Offline
Re: Why or what causes deer to smell to its fullest ability?
One year I shot a 3.5 year old 10 point in the morning that followed my walking path all the way to the treestand. I never had a deer freak when they hit my ground scent. They usually stop and get curious. These were mostly on hunts during the rut where deer can come from anywhere. Not sure why I've heard other people say they bolt. My airborne scent is different they usually bolt right away or the young deer just get nervous. I had a very successful bowhunter tell me he wanted the wind behind him entering his treestand. That way if a deer came in up wind there would be ground scent but the deer couldnt smell where he's at. If a deer came in downwind then he could smell where he's at but there would be no ground scent. It gave the deer only one reason not two to get nervous.Opposite of what most think and he was successful.
[ Post made via Android ]
[ Post made via Android ]
- Bonecrusher101
- 500 Club
- Posts: 3091
- Joined: Sat Mar 21, 2015 3:09 am
- Location: West TN
- Status: Offline
Re: Why or what causes deer to smell to its fullest ability?
I think temperature factors in at some point as well. I think the colder it gets the more difficult it is for him to smell you. I can smell road kill by driving by it in the summer. I've gone and poked at road kill bucks during the winter, trying to get the antlers and couldn't smell them. Another example, my garbage can smells awful during the summer, same trash, same can, goes unnoticed in winter months.
The smell of love trumps all other smells during the rut. The story of the booner 12 vs the p&y 8 is also interesting to me. My bet would be it has to do with a deers personality. If I'm a stud buck during the rut, I know I'm king of the woods. Not worried about anything but this hot doe. A smaller 8 on the other hand is more cautious and has had his but kicked before. His instinct tells him to follow a hot doe but it's also warning him to be cautious.
I enjoy late season because bucks seem to be less wary. Maybe it has to do with cold weather temps hindering their sense of smell, maybe it's a combo of things. I'd be tired after running for days on end. I'd be starving and desperate for groceries. I'd be predicable and lazy till spring green up.
Early bow season and mild weather days have had deer bust me the most. I honestly do think they can smell better when it's warmer. Maybe cause the wind/thermals are shifting and I'm not watching my milkweeds. Maybe cause deer aren't worn down lazy and predicable this time of year. With abundant food they have the option to avoid danger and feed where they feel comfy. It's probably just a combo of factors.
[ Post made via iPhone ]
The smell of love trumps all other smells during the rut. The story of the booner 12 vs the p&y 8 is also interesting to me. My bet would be it has to do with a deers personality. If I'm a stud buck during the rut, I know I'm king of the woods. Not worried about anything but this hot doe. A smaller 8 on the other hand is more cautious and has had his but kicked before. His instinct tells him to follow a hot doe but it's also warning him to be cautious.
I enjoy late season because bucks seem to be less wary. Maybe it has to do with cold weather temps hindering their sense of smell, maybe it's a combo of things. I'd be tired after running for days on end. I'd be starving and desperate for groceries. I'd be predicable and lazy till spring green up.
Early bow season and mild weather days have had deer bust me the most. I honestly do think they can smell better when it's warmer. Maybe cause the wind/thermals are shifting and I'm not watching my milkweeds. Maybe cause deer aren't worn down lazy and predicable this time of year. With abundant food they have the option to avoid danger and feed where they feel comfy. It's probably just a combo of factors.
[ Post made via iPhone ]
Be original and Enjoy every step along the adventure.
-
- Posts: 60
- Joined: Mon Sep 14, 2015 10:16 pm
- Status: Offline
Re: Why or what causes deer to smell to its fullest ability?
Speaking from my experiences,,All depends on your local hunting pressure. I grew up hunting MI,,mostly N-MI. Heavy pressure. Deer very spooky. You had to be very careful of scent and disturbing the environment. I once paid for a hunt in S Dakota. Cattle Ranch. Rifle hunting Ranch. Three thou acres. Limited hunting. I was first bow hunter they ever had. Could not believe how TAME the deer were. They drove me up to a tree to put up a stand at noon one day. Sawed branches,,hoisted stand,,sweat all over the place. I said,"I cant hunt here tonight?" They said,,sure ya can. They had me climb up an Aluminum ladder into the stand. They even left the ladder on the ground at the base of the tree! I tell you the truth,,deer came walking right past me,,across all that sweat,,cut pine boughs,,even stepping over the ladder. Bucks,,,does with fawns,,I could not believe my EYES! Where I hunt now,,in IA,,deer are not that tame,,but better than N-MI. I am out in my plots a lot,,lots of farm activity around me. Deer,,even 5 yr old bucks,,will tolerate some human scent,,especially just scent from walking to the stand.. Coarse all deer are different,,and the RUT,,anything can happen,,but I believe a lot has to do with Hunt Pressure...
-
- 500 Club
- Posts: 4576
- Joined: Thu Oct 18, 2012 5:26 am
- Location: IA
- Status: Offline
Re: Why or what causes deer to smell to its fullest ability?
I think the limiting factor is the power of a whitetail's brain and that explains some of the variability. This is probably going to rub some the wrong way but we as hunters like to build them up to some super-animal but in reality an average deer is not that smart compared to some other animals. All herbivores are not the smartest in the animal world, carnivores (predators) tend to be capable of more complex decision making and behavior. I am pretty sure the dog family is significantly smarter - look at an adult coyote's behavior compared to a adult deer. Even a "wiley old buck" is not as smart as a "wiley old coyote." Interpreting smells (is old human smell safe? Should I come back? How about when a human just left or when there is just a wiff of human scent in a swirling wind? What about human scent next to bedding versus food or downwind of a house?) takes brain power and there is a range of intelligence in the deer in an area.
Another factor is just environmental conditions like others have mentioned. Low humidity associated with super cold weather greatly limits what a deer can smell. After doing some hunting in extreme cold last year, and then looking back in my notes from past years, I believe most of the time a deer probably won't even detect me while hunting if its more than 50-60 yards away and the temperature is in the single digits or below zero. Huge difference.
Another factor is just environmental conditions like others have mentioned. Low humidity associated with super cold weather greatly limits what a deer can smell. After doing some hunting in extreme cold last year, and then looking back in my notes from past years, I believe most of the time a deer probably won't even detect me while hunting if its more than 50-60 yards away and the temperature is in the single digits or below zero. Huge difference.
-
- Site Owner
- Posts: 41638
- Joined: Sat Feb 13, 2010 6:11 am
- Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/HuntingBeast/?ref=bookmarks
- Location: S.E. Wisconsin
- Contact:
- Status: Offline
Re: Why or what causes deer to smell to its fullest ability?
I believe that a deers nose is so very increadable you are not fooling it, or using a product to reduce your scent enough to make any difference at all... But there is a variation in reaction based on the individual bucks tolerance and paranoia.
A lot of people think they have fooled a deers nose or beaten it because of lack of reaction from the deer, but some deer react that way. I can remember many hunts where I glassed from a distance and watched bucks pass thru a small area daily. I move in to kill one of those bucks and the deer cross my ground scent or get down wind and no deer shows a reaction. No shots fired, leave after the deer are gone, and those deer don't show up in that spot again... When that happens over and over its not coincidence...
The absolute worst reactions I get are when I slip into the edge of the safe zone where they are most vulnerable and least expect me.. But even there I get some deer that show little to no reaction, but over all, more reaction from that area...
They smell you everywhere, but accept in in certain stimuli
A lot of people think they have fooled a deers nose or beaten it because of lack of reaction from the deer, but some deer react that way. I can remember many hunts where I glassed from a distance and watched bucks pass thru a small area daily. I move in to kill one of those bucks and the deer cross my ground scent or get down wind and no deer shows a reaction. No shots fired, leave after the deer are gone, and those deer don't show up in that spot again... When that happens over and over its not coincidence...
The absolute worst reactions I get are when I slip into the edge of the safe zone where they are most vulnerable and least expect me.. But even there I get some deer that show little to no reaction, but over all, more reaction from that area...
They smell you everywhere, but accept in in certain stimuli
- johndeere506
- 500 Club
- Posts: 1394
- Joined: Wed Oct 23, 2013 5:59 am
- Location: MI
- Status: Offline
Re: Why or what causes deer to smell to its fullest ability?
Yes great topic. Bucks chasing love turn their super smell off. The blood flow to the brain is likely limited during this time lol. Fast moving deer sometimes react less, too much data to process so fast and less particles from your stream make it to their nose. Slow moving deer can pull in all the scent. Drive past rotting roadkill at 60mph, then at 5 mph, that's what I mean. Which is more alarming. One of my bucks last year locked up and blew when he crossed my trail, he wasn't used to smelling it there, he made a scrape 10 yards prior, suggesting he was not on alert. Urban deer and safe zones are very true. Deviate from that and they freak, supersmell activated.
I'm not sure if they smell easier in warm weather, but by late season here they gotten used to some human smell over the past 3 months. So not sure if it's tolerance buildup, or less ability. This is doe and yearlings, big bucks still won't tolerate it.
[ Post made via Android ]
I'm not sure if they smell easier in warm weather, but by late season here they gotten used to some human smell over the past 3 months. So not sure if it's tolerance buildup, or less ability. This is doe and yearlings, big bucks still won't tolerate it.
[ Post made via Android ]
- cbay
- 500 Club
- Posts: 1196
- Joined: Mon Nov 25, 2013 8:39 am
- Location: Mo
- Status: Offline
Re: Why or what causes deer to smell to its fullest ability?
A few years ago i was hunting the public at home and had a lot of grunting and chasing going on in the thickets several hours before dark. The doe ended up getting bumped out of the thicket and then got downwind of me. She stayed there stomping and looking for me and not long after the buck came out grunting. When he caught my wind he bounced back into the thicket as quick as he could. The doe continued to stay right behind me stomping and now looking at me. I could not believe what happened next. This buck came right back out the same spot grunting and stopped half way between me and the doe in the open woods on an access trail and stood there looking up at me as i tried to draw and shoot behind me. One limb saved him and after a few seconds he starts grunting again and starts chasing her again bouncing and grunting through the open woods and out of sight.
No big deal if this was rut and a young buck, but this was Oct. 15 and was the biggest bodied deer i've had an encounter with on public land. A big mature heavily hunted buck.
The point related to this topic is that this buck had fully identified me right from the start regardless of being in full on chase with this doe which evidently came in heat early. He however chose not to flee and instead go after her anyway. His senses were still there - as he bounced off my scent and back into the thicket the first time. But because of the doe he did it anyway.
Thought this was pretty interesting and had to share.
No big deal if this was rut and a young buck, but this was Oct. 15 and was the biggest bodied deer i've had an encounter with on public land. A big mature heavily hunted buck.
The point related to this topic is that this buck had fully identified me right from the start regardless of being in full on chase with this doe which evidently came in heat early. He however chose not to flee and instead go after her anyway. His senses were still there - as he bounced off my scent and back into the thicket the first time. But because of the doe he did it anyway.
Thought this was pretty interesting and had to share.
Scout. Learn. Hunt
-
- 500 Club
- Posts: 9756
- Joined: Wed Mar 16, 2011 11:28 am
- Location: Central WI
- Status: Offline
Re: Why or what causes deer to smell to its fullest ability?
JoeRE wrote:I think the limiting factor is the power of a whitetail's brain and that explains some of the variability. This is probably going to rub some the wrong way but we as hunters like to build them up to some super-animal but in reality an average deer is not that smart compared to some other animals. All herbivores are not the smartest in the animal world, carnivores (predators) tend to be capable of more complex decision making and behavior. I am pretty sure the dog family is significantly smarter - look at an adult coyote's behavior compared to a adult deer. Even a "wiley old buck" is not as smart as a "wiley old coyote." Interpreting smells (is old human smell safe? Should I come back? How about when a human just left or when there is just a wiff of human scent in a swirling wind? What about human scent next to bedding versus food or downwind of a house?) takes brain power and there is a range of intelligence in the deer in an area.
Do you think pressure/predators foster intelligence?
-
- 500 Club
- Posts: 9756
- Joined: Wed Mar 16, 2011 11:28 am
- Location: Central WI
- Status: Offline
Re: Why or what causes deer to smell to its fullest ability?
dan wrote: The absolute worst reactions I get are when I slip into the edge of the safe zone where they are most vulnerable and least expect me.. But even there I get some deer that show little to no reaction, but over all, more reaction from that area...
I agree, but in good bedding/staging, there are spot(s) where he can stand and drink in the scent from the surrounding area before moving on. He is elevating his awareness / ability at this point. Similarly there are places in the comfort zone where he isn't drinking it up unless alarmed.
-
- Site Owner
- Posts: 41638
- Joined: Sat Feb 13, 2010 6:11 am
- Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/HuntingBeast/?ref=bookmarks
- Location: S.E. Wisconsin
- Contact:
- Status: Offline
Re: Why or what causes deer to smell to its fullest ability?
BassBoysLLP wrote:dan wrote: The absolute worst reactions I get are when I slip into the edge of the safe zone where they are most vulnerable and least expect me.. But even there I get some deer that show little to no reaction, but over all, more reaction from that area...
I agree, but in good bedding/staging, there are spot(s) where he can stand and drink in the scent from the surrounding area before moving on. He is elevating his awareness / ability at this point. Similarly there are places in the comfort zone where he isn't drinking it up unless alarmed.
Absolutely... The big buck I am chasing now comes down from a bed to where he stages (and can see) and then circles way out of his way to enter a low spot where all the thermals drop to in the calm of the evening. When he comes out earlier than the thermal drop, he don't bother going over there.
-
- Posts: 5586
- Joined: Tue Aug 31, 2010 12:35 am
- Location: Appleton WI
- Status: Offline
Re: Why or what causes deer to smell to its fullest ability?
You guys have never had a deer "freak out" on ground scent I CAN SAY 100% I have seen it numerous times! Especially when you push into thick cover where they have not smelt a human since last hunting season
I think ground scent is as bad or close to as bad as the scent stream blowing from your tree stand
Fawns and young bucks might ignore it... but a mature buck.. NO WAY
I think ground scent is as bad or close to as bad as the scent stream blowing from your tree stand
Fawns and young bucks might ignore it... but a mature buck.. NO WAY
"When a hunter is in a tree stand with high moral values, with the proper hunting ethics and richer for the experience, that hunter is 20 feet closer to God." Fred Bear
-
- Advertisement
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 34 guests