Im looking for an Ah-Ha moment

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Divergent
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Im looking for an Ah-Ha moment

Unread postby Divergent » Tue Sep 15, 2015 1:19 pm

I've read so much information over the years and I just can't wrap my head around a few things. Maybe I'm trying to combine different theories or just simply uneducated. This is what I think I know...please correct me if I'm wrong.

More times than not when the rut is off, the bucks tend to move more in heavy cover and return to their beds well before daylight. Sometimes later in the AM due to a Full Moon. It's also my understanding that we hunt rising thermals in the AM so our scent will be carried up above bedding and trails.
This is where it gets fuzzy for me. My thermals usually switch at approximately 8AM, so from daylight til 8AM they're still falling. If I'm anticipating the bucks to be traveling in this time frame, then why does everyone focus on hunting above beds and trails?

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Re: Im looking for an Ah-Ha moment

Unread postby Divergent » Tue Sep 15, 2015 8:01 pm

Anyone?

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JoeRE
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Re: Im looking for an Ah-Ha moment

Unread postby JoeRE » Tue Sep 15, 2015 11:20 pm

You are spot on about thermals....they are falling in the first hour or two of the morning depending on weather so you need to hunt below trails or beds, or at least be able to shoot to right before where a deer can smell you. Most of the hunt high advice applies to later in the day with thermals rising OR days with a decent amount of wind which will override thermal activity a lot of the time.


As far as the ah-ha moment, I wish I could say there is one but I guess that depends a little on the person. I don't get ah-has much. mostly its just slowly learn more year after year....every decade or so you can look back and say, wow did I learn a lot. This is not an instant gratification sport.
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Re: Im looking for an Ah-Ha moment

Unread postby Motivated » Tue Sep 15, 2015 11:38 pm

I almost didn't open this because I expected it to be another ozonics thread. "Ozonics aha moment." Also many guys who have early openers are just plain busy getting it done. My season doesn't open till October 1st however.

You are close to understanding things. I believe your confusion comes in due to the fact that there are rising thermals and falling thermals. Set ups on these are different. Most of the setups you are reading about our afternoon setups. Many guys here only hunt afternoons and evenings, and use the morning to eat or sleep in spend with family or scout.

In the morning the thermals are falling and the buck usually J hooks or swoops downwind of his bed to smell any predators that might be waiting there to ambush him. It it's hard to predict what direction the buck might come to J hook into the bed. Also these winds are more variable, making the hunter success rate lower. Finally, oftentimes the mature bucks will get to bed way before shooting light. So many folks don't want to risk burning out a buck bed on a low chance of success. That's why most of the setups are evening setups waiting for the buck to get out of a specific bed and walk past your trail. Thermals are rising in the afternoon until they switch later.

In the evening the thermals will start to fall again and that can signal your time to leave/change your setup or signal the time to go walk out to your setup. Many hunters here already have setups planned out for wind and thermals. You are likely assuming that he's discussing a morning set up (falling thermals) when in actuality it's probably an afternoon or evening set up (rising thermals).

It can be confusing trying to read things and put the pieces together. Read the all time best tactical threads and use the search feature for specific topics too. That helped me a great deal.

I'm glad you posted your question. I am not very experienced compared to many guys here, but I hope that was helpful. Keep reading and asking questions! You will get there! Good luck this season.

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Re: Im looking for an Ah-Ha moment

Unread postby headgear » Tue Sep 15, 2015 11:52 pm

I'm not a hill country hunter so take this with a grain of salt, they would hunt up higher for the morning rut cruising tunnel and evening setups on beds outside the rut. Some of the guys go in a little late in the morning and setup, others might hunt low early in the am and then move as the thermals are switching but this can spread a lot of scent in a particular area so it may not be advised if you are hunting smaller parcels. If you are hunting beds early in the am I would take it on a case by case basis, you have to have an idea how that buck will approach a bed and setup that way but also keeping those thermals and wind in mind so it can be a little tricky.

As far as that ah ha moment goes everyone is different, maybe you already had yours because you are hear soaking up all the info, you know you need to hunt differently than others. Maybe it will click when you have that first bedding or wind tunnel encounter. It can hit you like a ton of bricks or like Joe said slowly build up over time.
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Re: Im looking for an Ah-Ha moment

Unread postby Southern Man » Tue Sep 15, 2015 11:59 pm

I agree with Joe, it's not instant gratification. If you take what is taught here and apply it to your hunting areas, you hunting style will change. As you gain experience with this at some point you will look back and thing "Wow, I see now" Also remember what you read and see in pics here is the best of the best. Things vary from area to area but the basic principles are the same.

Keep after it, learn, have fun.
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Re: Im looking for an Ah-Ha moment

Unread postby Edcyclopedia » Wed Sep 16, 2015 12:17 am

Forrest Gump said that hunting was like a box of Chocolates, you never know til you hunt/get inside :mrgreen:

Each bite of chocolate is a new experience and when you come across another chocolate that is the same, you remember the 1st one, and continue to enjoy that bite, but might eat the whole thing... That's the score!

Be the chocolate young man, be the chocolate... I digress... ;)

Lastly, Never stop trying the different chocolate types and Never stop trying to find other places that the chocolates could be found.

If it works You'll find it to be quite sweet & appetizing!
Expect the Unexpected when you least Expect it...
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Re: Im looking for an Ah-Ha moment

Unread postby BigHunt » Wed Sep 16, 2015 12:41 am

That's a good question. ....

I always set up high knowing my wind is bad but I also know in two hours or so the thermals will switch ....the main reason why I do it is because is I'm not going to set up for 2 or 3 hours then pack up and hual up the ridge and reset. ..I could have a stand pre set but.....the thermals are not always in the same spot so I adjust accordingly every time. ..
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Re: Im looking for an Ah-Ha moment

Unread postby BigHunt » Wed Sep 16, 2015 12:48 am

I've also seen this situation in hill contry...very windy...the wind over rides the thermals....the wind comes wiping over the ridge and swells like a snow drifting. ...I learned this one day on a 30 mile an hour wind ...I wachted the wind pick up and blew the leaves over the ridge...as it was swearling I could see other leaves getting drawn up the ridge .....kinda like a vacuum sucking the air upwards


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Re: Im looking for an Ah-Ha moment

Unread postby Hawthorne » Wed Sep 16, 2015 3:22 am

I think its hands on experience. You have to get out there and find out what works and develop a system for you. Andre said it in one of dans videos. What works for me might not work for you and what works for you might not work for me.

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Re: Im looking for an Ah-Ha moment

Unread postby headgear » Wed Sep 16, 2015 3:42 am

Hawthorne wrote:I think its hands on experience. You have to get out there and find out what works and develop a system for you. Andre said it in one of dans videos. What works for me might not work for you and what works for you might not work for me.

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Yep very much this, the principals taught here are very solid but you need to apply them to your land. Every bed I have ever hunting is different, every setup I have can change depending on weather or a multitude of other factors. The more you test and try things out the more you understand, you WILL make mistakes but that is part of the process. Don't look at mistakes as a bad thing look at them as a learning tool. I have jumped plenty of bucks out of their beds by mistake, now should I get mad at myself or learn from it? I usually look at it as a success, I was in the right spot when a nice buck was there at that time. Right away I go hop in his bed and setup a plant for a hunt later that year or the next season. We can ready and learn all day long about it bunt sometimes you just have to get your hands dirty and mess up before you get the experience needed to hunt this way.
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Re: Im looking for an Ah-Ha moment

Unread postby JoeRE » Wed Sep 16, 2015 5:23 am

That's a good illustration BH.

Everyone who hunts hills has been driven half mad at some point by wind and thermals they can't figure out. Its always a work in progress.
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Re: Im looking for an Ah-Ha moment

Unread postby Divergent » Thu Sep 17, 2015 12:23 am

Thanks to everyone for the replies. It's all coming together slowly but surely. Lots of good information on this site for sure. I've read over most of the tactical threads and learned a great deal. I guess I'm gonna have to try different approaches like you guys said until I get it nailed down since each situation takes slight adjustments.

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Re: Im looking for an Ah-Ha moment

Unread postby hunter10 » Thu Sep 17, 2015 12:28 am

A tip I can give that I wish I did for years is a simple one. Do all your scouting and come home and write down all the places you have access to. If you have a mobile setup than write down all the spots you want to hit ad beside them put the wind direction they are to be hunted on. If you have 20 spots and a wind direction to be hunted on, it will save you making a poor/quick decision on over hunting spots you are familiar with becuase of the frustrations of plans falling apart often, as stated above. Myself, I have a binder of hunt able spots and trees for my mobile setup as well as beds to hit but only on certain winds. The wind directions have a separate color code so I can quickly skim through and have a game plan each time on usually a fresh sit. This may not be an ah ha moment but it will give you more confidence and drive when your organized and not waste sits by over hunting areas because they are easy, close to the road, grandpas old faithful or the spot you saw a big one 3 years ago. Not getting stuck in the same motions was a eye opener for me

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Re: Im looking for an Ah-Ha moment

Unread postby Kraftd » Thu Sep 17, 2015 2:12 am

This has been touched on earlier a little, but I think the real ah-ha moment is just realizing regularly getting on and killing big bucks is hard work. I'm still learning that, but I think just realizing that it is all of the little details, and putting in the time. No short-cuts to be successful regularly.


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