On shore off shore breeze

[dirt nap giver]

After thinking about the recent wind scent topics, I have been thinking more so on my situation. And here it is.

50-60% of my hunting locations are close to Lake Michigan.
From my observation, hunting within 6 miles of the lake, while also having winds 8 mph and below about 45 minutes before dark and 45 minutes of first light yields a westerly off shore breeze. To clarify, on a given hunting day, if I am hunting within 6 miles of the lake and the wind is less than 7-8 mph, prior to sun rise the thermal is out of the east, then roughly 45 minutes after sun rise, the wind switches into the prevailing daily wind direction till 45 minutes before dark it switches back out of the east again.
I have tried to wait it out till the days prevailing wind kicks in before starting my stand approach and that does more harm than good. I have tried vise versa as well with the same result.

So for those who don't practice of believe in scent efforts, how would you approach this?

[ Post made via iPhone ]

[Stanley]

I'm lost?

[dirt nap giver]

Pre dawn- east off shore breeze
45 minutes after dawn the prevailing wind for the day kicks in and dominates throughout the day.
45 minutes before dark the off shore breeze kicks in again.

Sorry for the confusion.

[ Post made via iPhone ]

[dan]

So for those who don't practice of believe in scent efforts, how would you approach this?

With precision access and stand positioning... You need to know where the deer are, what the wind is doing, and what it will be doing, and access and set up without them winding you. If you think you can run in and set up anywhere cause you use scent control, your going to fail a lot.

[PK_]

Man, that's rough. I deal with that a lot but it is on a more 'micro' level, with swamps pulling/pushing thermals. I like sunny days, I use the predawn airflow to keep my scent from where I believe the deer are, I get high in the tree and know that the rising daytime thermals will be pulling hard by the time the prevailing wind kicks in. The last few years I have killed a couple of bucks using this strategy. I have also found areas where the deer stage in the morning waiting for the prevailing wind to show up before heading to bedding. They are basically thick secluded areas that act as a sort of 'hub' between bedding areas for multiple winds.

[Stanley]

My thoughts would be to select the days when the wind over powers the thermal current of the lake.

[KLEMZ]

Dirt Nap, I live 5 miles from Lake Michigan on the Wisconsin side. Our lake thermal breezes are definately influenced by the predicted actual wind direction. On my side of the lake (in summertime) a straight west (actual) wind will result in a straight east lake breeze(for at least 6 miles from the lake). (warmer land mass pulling the breeze in). BUT, if the actual wind is SW, then the lake breeze will be SE. In other words the actual breeze (no matter how light), does influence the direction of the lake thermal. The opposite holds true also, a NW wind translates into a NE lake breeze. Maybe this could help you in your hunting setups.

[Thermals]

Not sure if this helps but most mornings here without water there is a slight east wind almost every morning until the sun comes up good and the wind if can't kicks in. With that being said if I even hunt a morning I wait till 830 or 9 before I go in.

[ Post made via iPhone ]

[KLEMZ]

Another comment on thermals near Lake Michigan....this is thermal activity on steroids! During the summer in Wisconsin, the temperature difference between the warm land (rising air) and the cold water (sinking air) is often 30-35 degrees difference (on the Wisconsin side, the surface temperature of the lake is 20 degrees colder than the Michigan side when there is a west wind, because the warm surface water blows over to Michigan)

What this means is that on a typical 85 degree summer day, with a west wind of 10 mph, there will be a 8-10 mph EAST wind coming back off the lake during the afternoon. This east wind carries at least 6 miles away from the lake!...and there is no waiting for dusk (and calm winds) for the thermals to over power the wind. This thermal wind is just as strong as the actual wind..just going the other way, during the day!

How is this possible? Well, I have noticed that the "steam" coming out of a nearby power plant 300' smoke stack, is indeed going straight west just as the weatherman said. However, flags closer to the ground (40'), are flying with an east wind. So basically, the warm air and the cooler air stratify into layers during the day.

What this means to me is that the 5-6 mile buffer around Lake Michigan is it's own little micro climate, different from anywhere else. I know from personal observation that the lilacs bloom 2 WEEKS LATER! in the spring if you are within 5 miles of Lake Michigan. Drive 10 miles from the lake and it is a totally different world.

Does this have any significance to deer hunting? Well, I have a couple thoughts here. Everybody wants to live near the lake, so there is a lot of development (human intrusion) within 5 miles of Lake Michigan. Bottom line, there aren't a lot of great places for a buck to grow old because there are people everywhere. BUT, if you can find a place with some good deer habitat (within 5 miles) you may have an opportunity to shoot a slob! Since the wind behaves differently here, most hunters will get busted by the buck before they ever have a chance, because they are using standard wisdom regarding the wind. If you are a student of the beast, you will be paying attention to predicted winds, thermals, milkweed testing etc. and will figure out a way to kill a buck that has easily avoided hunters over the years.

Two of the biggest dead bucks I have ever seen in the back of a pick up truck, were both shot within a mile of Lake Michigan. Sadly, not by me!

[BassBoysLLP]

So for those who don't practice of believe in scent efforts, how would you approach this?

With precision access and stand positioning... You need to know where the deer are, what the wind is doing, and what it will be doing, and access and set up without them winding you. If you think you can run in and set up anywhere cause you use scent control, your going to fail a lot.

Agreed. Many years ago I hunted along the shores of Green Bay with a similar wind pattern. Getting high wasn't an option. There were hardly any trees in the marsh, let alone big trees. The bedding was very predictable though. I didn't have a lot of success back then. To be honest I was young and stupid, but these days I would focus on a justoff setup with respect to the evening winds and scent control to minimize unavoidable dispersion that can't be seen with the floaters.

[ Post made via Android ]

[dirt nap giver]

So for those who don't practice of believe in scent efforts, how would you approach this?

With precision access and stand positioning... You need to know where the deer are, what the wind is doing, and what it will be doing, and access and set up without them winding you. If you think you can run in and set up anywhere cause you use scent control, your going to fail a lot.

Thats just it! With on/off shore breezes, variable winds, low pressure systems etc, I'm trying to figure this out without using scent control, which is the biggest contributing factor to the bucks I've killed near the lakeshore thus far. Believe me when I say, if I could ditch the scent control, I would! I have tried without it, and failed more than when I was using it.

[dirt nap giver]

My thoughts would be to select the days when the wind over powers the thermal current of the lake.

This has worked as well, just sick of only getting a few of those days an entire season when I know they are in there.

[dirt nap giver]

Dirt Nap, I live 5 miles from Lake Michigan on the Wisconsin side. Our lake thermal breezes are definately influenced by the predicted actual wind direction. On my side of the lake (in summertime) a straight west (actual) wind will result in a straight east lake breeze(for at least 6 miles from the lake). (warmer land mass pulling the breeze in). BUT, if the actual wind is SW, then the lake breeze will be SE. In other words the actual breeze (no matter how light), does influence the direction of the lake thermal. The opposite holds true also, a NW wind translates into a NE lake breeze. Maybe this could help you in your hunting setups.

WOW! Thats it! After thinking about this post for the last few days, I do recall the thermal variation based on prevailing wind direction. HHHHHMMMMMMM! Let the wind journal begin. Thank you sir! Finally! Someone who has experience with this.

[dirt nap giver]

Not sure if this helps but most mornings here without water there is a slight east wind almost every morning until the sun comes up good and the wind if can't kicks in. With that being said if I even hunt a morning I wait till 830 or 9 before I go in.

[ Post made via iPhone ]

I have been working that route as well, but often times, I bust them out of there. What I have noticed is, the mature bucks are bedded before daylight utilizing the off shore breeze(East) till the prevailing wind kicks in, then they move again to utilize that wind. That transition happens around 9-9:30. I know where they bed before daylight and where they bed mid day, but majority of the time, there isnt a week point in the bedding system they are using.

[dirt nap giver]

Another comment on thermals near Lake Michigan....this is thermal activity on steroids! During the summer in Wisconsin, the temperature difference between the warm land (rising air) and the cold water (sinking air) is often 30-35 degrees difference (on the Wisconsin side, the surface temperature of the lake is 20 degrees colder than the Michigan side when there is a west wind, because the warm surface water blows over to Michigan)

What this means is that on a typical 85 degree summer day, with a west wind of 10 mph, there will be a 8-10 mph EAST wind coming back off the lake during the afternoon. This east wind carries at least 6 miles away from the lake!...and there is no waiting for dusk (and calm winds) for the thermals to over power the wind. This thermal wind is just as strong as the actual wind..just going the other way, during the day!

How is this possible? Well, I have noticed that the "steam" coming out of a nearby power plant 300' smoke stack, is indeed going straight west just as the weatherman said. However, flags closer to the ground (40'), are flying with an east wind. So basically, the warm air and the cooler air stratify into layers during the day.

What this means to me is that the 5-6 mile buffer around Lake Michigan is it's own little micro climate, different from anywhere else. I know from personal observation that the lilacs bloom 2 WEEKS LATER! in the spring if you are within 5 miles of Lake Michigan. Drive 10 miles from the lake and it is a totally different world.

Does this have any significance to deer hunting? Well, I have a couple thoughts here. Everybody wants to live near the lake, so there is a lot of development (human intrusion) within 5 miles of Lake Michigan. Bottom line, there aren't a lot of great places for a buck to grow old because there are people everywhere. BUT, if you can find a place with some good deer habitat (within 5 miles) you may have an opportunity to shoot a slob! Since the wind behaves differently here, most hunters will get busted by the buck before they ever have a chance, because they are using standard wisdom regarding the wind. If you are a student of the beast, you will be paying attention to predicted winds, thermals, milkweed testing etc. and will figure out a way to kill a buck that has easily avoided hunters over the years.

Two of the biggest dead bucks I have ever seen in the back of a pick up truck, were both shot within a mile of Lake Michigan. Sadly, not by me!

There is so much truth to this post. I have tried for years to have an intellectual conversation with people regarding this dilemma and end in the same place I started.

Milkweed hasn't shown me anything before, but after reading your previous post, I now know what to look for.