where does a deer's antler typically reduce in size?

[LogicallyCompromised]

i understand that a male deer, if allowed to live, will have some years where their antlers peak(5.5-7.5years old?) and then began to reduce in overall mass. i suspect it might have to do with lack of diet due to teeth wear? i saw some antlers that someone claimed to come from a very mature deer; i am intentionally leaving their suspected age out. what stood out in my mind was the base of the antlers on this typically 4x4 8pt. the circumference just up from the mushroom base was 3.5"; using the attached image measurement at c1. the t1 (i think brow tine) was 2". i am estimating the length of beams at about 18".



my question; can a deer past its prime have such little girth at their base and such short measurements; like a 2.5 year old?

maybe hurt both its back legs? even then i thought the girth would still be much larger at base but just lack length. i thought the base of the antlers would only continue to add girth each year and any lose would be minimal from base and more from length, no?

where does a deer's antler typically reduce in size?

the mature deer past their prime i have seen in images, still had enormous girth at the c1 measurement.

[BigHills BuckHunter]

What I see personally is that when a buck gets older, he loses tine length and even spread. Usually gains the mass and could come up with sticker points. No expert here, just what I see from sheds and video from year to year.

[nater]

What I see personally is that when a buck gets older, he loses tine length and even spread. Usually gains the mass and could come up with sticker points. No expert here, just what I see from sheds and video from year to year.

That's what I've always heard too. My frame of reference is very limited though as 90% of the antlers I've seen were sheds from deer I have no history with, thus prohibiting any age analysis.

[iowa whitetail]

I think every deer is different they loose more tine length than mass I agree with that

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[dan]

In ag areas with good food I rarely see a decrease in size that everyone talks about. I recall one non-typical buck that lived in the marsh near my home. He lived to be 9.5 years old and a neighbor who had a deer feeder had almost every shed from the buck. Every single year the bucks antlers were bigger than the year before till 9.5 when a hunter shot him and he was scored at 217.

I am sure some bucks do go down in size, but I think its at an older age than most think, or its because of an injury, illness, or bad winter.

[iowa whitetail]

In ag areas with good food I rarely see a decrease in size that everyone talks about. I recall one non-typical buck that lived in the marsh near my home. He lived to be 9.5 years old and a neighbor who had a deer feeder had almost every shed from the buck. Every single year the bucks antlers were bigger than the year before till 9.5 when a hunter shot him and he was scored at 217.

I am sure some bucks do go down in size, but I think its at an older age than most think, or its because of an injury, illness, or bad winter.

I agree with that also just because a rack is smaller doesn't mean it has less bone it's just the way it grew could have thicker tines but that's not scorable . I think there should be a scoring system with water put the exact amount of water in a tub put the rack in up to the beginning of the skull plate and see how far the water comes up that would be a true total bone method

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[Knute78]

In ag areas with good food I rarely see a decrease in size that everyone talks about. I recall one non-typical buck that lived in the marsh near my home. He lived to be 9.5 years old and a neighbor who had a deer feeder had almost every shed from the buck. Every single year the bucks antlers were bigger than the year before till 9.5 when a hunter shot him and he was scored at 217.

I am sure some bucks do go down in size, but I think its at an older age than most think, or its because of an injury, illness, or bad winter.

I agree with that also just because a rack is smaller doesn't mean it has less bone it's just the way it grew could have thicker tines but that's not scorable . I think there should be a scoring system with water put the exact amount of water in a tub put the rack in up to the beginning of the skull plate and see how far the water comes up that would be a true total bone method

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I agree. I mentioned this on here a year or more ago. I think measuring total cubic inches through water displacement would make more sense. It would be a scoring system that puts all antlers on an even scoring system with no deductions. The toughest part would be measuring all antlers equally at the bases without having to remove them completely.

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[JoeRE]

It really depends on the individual whitetail. I have seen bucks that just keep adding inches their who lives. I followed an 8 pointer for a number of years that grew his largest rack the year he died (just under 140"), at least 9 years old. As a 4/5 year old he was only right around 125 gross. I also shot a 11 point typical, mid 160s, with teeth worn flat - I would pretty confidently say he was over 6 years old and plan on cementum aging him one of these days. He added almost 20" of typical antler from the year before, I found his sheds. On the flip side, there are some other bucks that I have shot that actually got smaller from the year or two before and they were in their prime, 5/6/7, which is supposed to be peak typical antler growth.

The buck you describe does sound pretty small but I have seen some incredibly runty mature bucks and I don't know where the deer in question was shot. Just like maybe the top 5% of bucks in here Iowa have the potential to be booners, the bottom 5% might not break P&Y ever. I do agree in general that bucks add inches of tine length up to 6-8ish then just add more mass and kickers but like my examples above there is a lot of variation.

Injury definitely affects antler growth. If there is an injured leg it is routine for the opposite side of the rack to be smaller or malformed the next year. If the deer is not healthy you will also see a lot smaller antlers than normal.

[bones09]

I think antler growth is very conditional. In the late 90's thru about 2009 my family was lucky enough to have an albino buck using our property. We picked up his sheds nearly every year after he was 3. The largest side he grew was just under 80" at 7.5 years old. His matched set at 9.5 were both still over 72" tho. It wasn't until he was 10 years old that he truly hit the wall and had a major decline, at 10 he grew 6 points up and 4 drops.

The reason i think its conditional tho is this past fall ('13) there were a handful of bucks i was able to follow thru the '12 season and couldn't wait to see. All were between 130-165" the previous season. Not one of these bucks put on more than 10" in '13 and the two bigger bucks didn't actually gain any antler, maybe lost. Still i don't believe it was because they are all(or any) past their prime. Everything is conditional with the tough winters we've been having lately, i'm excited to see what this summer/fall brings.

I believe that a buck could grow it's best antlers anytime between its 5th and 9th birthday, mostly depends on weather/food conditions and the individual health of the animal.

[Trailcamaddict]

I don't typically score anything so don't get into scores too much but the whole idea of using water displacement to score is the best thing I have ever heard of for scoring! That would be the most telling way of scoring which gives true service to the animals.

[LogicallyCompromised]

thank you all for sharing your information.

has anyone ever seen such small girth on a 4.5+ deer; e.g. just over 1" diameter? i have seen girth on 4.5-5.5 deer from new england and their girth is on another level when compared to 2.5 deer. i questioned them the day i saw the antlers on the lack of girth and inches and they mentioned how worn the teeth were and the weight. this deer was never weighed and i question how it could have remained this heavy with alleged tooth wear and shot deep into the rut; person claimed deer was on a feeder. if on a feeder i would assume proper nutrition for proper antlers per it's genetics. only really leaving the deer had injured both back legs or i continue to question the source. even the deer with hurt legs i still see girth but severally lack inches when compared to other antler. also these antlers were beautifully typically which conflicts with leg injures, i thought.

i just can not accept this deer was any older than 3.5 and i am more inclined to think 2.5. the weight of the deer and the tooth wear muddy my assessment and i question how embellished both claims are.

what is the smallest girth and main-beam length you have seen on a healthy 4.5+ deer?

thank you all for your time thus far.

[SamPotter]

It's certainly not uncommon for hunters to wishfully think their buck is older than it is. My favorite is "well, he has a grey face so he must be really old."

I have 6 bucks that I've aged by cementum annuli analysis. The youngest was a 3 year old and he has 3.75" bases. All the other bucks were 4+5 year olds and none had bases less than 4.5".

I picked up a set of sheds in CT a few weeks ago that are off a buck that was 9 years old. The bases are close to 5" and the rest of the antler is palmated, so lots of mass.

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[LogicallyCompromised]

thank you again for the responses. my questions were addressed and i am happy with the responses. i understand there maybe exceptions but the observations of those more experienced than i are tough to argue against, again; thank you all.

i also will not score a deer(easy to do when i have not put down a mature buck) nor will i invest the time in learning how to do it. for those looking for mass the water displacement sounds accurate and logical.

thank you for the data mr. potter. i want to believe the data you submitted so i will pretend you did not find some sheds in connecticut; i.e. sheds in connecticut are like dividing by zero.

[SamPotter]

I grew up there, so for awhile every shed I found was from CT.

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[BigHills BuckHunter]

I think antler growth is very conditional. In the late 90's thru about 2009 my family was lucky enough to have an albino buck using our property. We picked up his sheds nearly every year after he was 3. The largest side he grew was just under 80" at 7.5 years old. His matched set at 9.5 were both still over 72" tho. It wasn't until he was 10 years old that he truly hit the wall and had a major decline, at 10 he grew 6 points up and 4 drops.

The reason i think its conditional tho is this past fall ('13) there were a handful of bucks i was able to follow thru the '12 season and couldn't wait to see. All were between 130-165" the previous season. Not one of these bucks put on more than 10" in '13 and the two bigger bucks didn't actually gain any antler, maybe lost. Still i don't believe it was because they are all(or any) past their prime. Everything is conditional with the tough winters we've been having lately, i'm excited to see what this summer/fall brings.

I believe that a buck could grow it's best antlers anytime between its 5th and 9th birthday, mostly depends on weather/food conditions and the individual health of the animal.

I saw the same. Very little growth compared to usual. One buck I took track of from last year was 3.5 yrs old and I'm guessing grew 10 inches maybe less. I posted pics of him at both years in trail cam forum. Neighbor got this buck in gun season.