Bed hunting in high deer density areas

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Ridgerunner7
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Bed hunting in high deer density areas

Unread postby Ridgerunner7 » Tue Mar 12, 2013 6:35 am

Any of you guys hunt places like this? I have very limited experience in what I would consider "high deer density areas" but the times I have I though bed hunting for mature deer would've been very difficult.

My limited observations were that the older bucks bedded in such a way that they were protected by other deer and their bedding areas and not necessarily your typical "big buck" bed. Meaning... the older buck was bedding behind pockets of doe groups using them almost like a look out or an "alarm system" as they would detect danger far before the danger could reach the buck. Sneaking close to these beds would surely cause a trickle effect of spooked deer and you'd never even know the mature deer was there.

Again my experience in this type of deer herd is very limited but that was what I quickly picked up on. I found hunting away from the beds (in hidden feeding areas or travel routes) to be more productive. The mature deer seemed to move earlier as the high numbers of does, fawns, and small bucks moved undisturbed to the food sources again using them as a look out. It wasn't all that uncommon to see mature deer feeding with a significant amount of daylight left. This was early season and the overall pressure was relatively low.

I doubt there are too many places like this but just curious if anyone else has noticed this trend?


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Re: Bed hunting in high deer density areas

Unread postby dan » Tue Mar 12, 2013 7:56 am

I have seen what your referring to quite a bit... However not every bedding area is protected by lesser deer, anywhere, and learning the big picture is more important... Some terrains seem to have more of the stacked bedding areas than others too... Its really common in hill country.
I do agree that high population areas the bigger bucks move much earlier. I have always assumed that was because the lesser deer up and moving around got them going... Still, some bucks, especially when they hit that 5 or older age class just don't move far in daylight no matter what.

I think the situation your referencing is why on private managed lands like a lot of our TV hosts hunt you can shoot the middle aged 3 y/o on food plots pretty easy...

Hunting Andraes farms in Iowa, Illinois, and other managed farms I have hunted with high populations I saw P&Y bucks move a pretty early... But it was still real rare to see the top aged animals move far in daylight. It kind of goes back to the post about being after occasional booners or consistent 130-150's...
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Re: Bed hunting in high deer density areas

Unread postby phade » Tue Mar 12, 2013 8:17 am

Me and Moog are fighting this situation right now.

We're in NY, but in arguably the highest deer density of any WMU in the state. Its also one of the better areas of the state for mature/book bucks, despite the insanely high pressure.

The parcel has a expansive bedding area of marsh (about 10-15 acres worth) with mature, isolated trees, each with its own 3-4 ft. island that deer can bed on. We literally stopped counting beds once we passed 50, and I suspect we hit 100+. Each island has pellets of varying age/decay, size, etc. and hair. We can tell they are doe beds for the most part. Still, we did find 2 beds that were likely one or more of the mature bucks (given 3.5+ in our world) based on pellet size, rubs right at the bed, and the general depression in the island ground. Now, I'm not saying there are a 100 deer bedded in there, but they use the beds often enough - and I suspect this spot becomes the defacto home base as soon as gun season starts and deer pile in en masse from surrounding properties. It is by far the best bedding within the given mile.

Both beds were nearby, about 40 yards from one another, but they were both well into the "core" of the bedding, with beds rining about 270 degrees around them, and the remaining tall reed grass with no appreciable bedding space. I actually stood in one of the beds yesterday, and just shuck my head in appreciation at how well "defended" this spot is. I tried as hard as I could, and I think the closest we could get a stand is 100+ yards due to the lay of the marsh, the transition, and the openess of the connecting woods.

Given that, I presume one of these bucks is one that we have considerable knowledge of, despite not hunting the property last year. We have cam pics from the prior landowner, and I found his sheds yesterday (posted on the shed thread). As dan mentioned, I think this buck ventures earlier from his bed, and photos show he returns later to it, even so much as being captured on the cam in the morning returning to his bed from the feeding ag field on the weekend of MZ season, which is mid December. I think that is simply a byproduct of the sheer number of deer. We're fairly confident of one route that he does take on what I would consider a regular basis (multiple times per week) from bed to food and vice versa. And, with the sheer number of beds around him and the predominant wind, we're forced to hunt this buck further from the bed than I would like, but at the same time, still feel that one of us has a decent shot to kill this buck early on. The former owner was a gun only hunter and not one we would consider more than recreational, despite being a nice guy.

He should be 4.5 this fall.
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Re: Bed hunting in high deer density areas

Unread postby dan » Tue Mar 12, 2013 9:43 am

Phade,
I often have stands back 100 or more yards, in hill country when does bed above the bucks I am often 200 yards back... I certainly don't want to be that far back, but sometimes you have no choice. The good news is they move a little earlier when there are a lot of deer, if the pressure is kept light. But still, sometimes its better to wait for the right day, or right conditions to make a move.

Another thing I have done successfully if there are only a couple beds in bad locations is to block those beds which cause you trouble getting close so they don't get used no more.
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Re: Bed hunting in high deer density areas

Unread postby JoeRE » Tue Mar 12, 2013 11:55 am

I hunt a couple high deer density hill country areas. What I have found though is the big bucks are generally still a bit separate from the herds of does - herds of does is a pretty accurate description I think. The does take over all the obvious, larger bedding areas and the bucks stick to the smallest benches, points and very small pockets of cover. As far as hunting strategy I definitely have not found a foolproof one. Sometimes I can hunt the bucks by sneaking in from the "far" side (a lot of times the big bucks bed further from the food than the does). Sometimes I only try a morning hunt or two - I know I can generally get in early enough before anything comes back to the bedding area and I try to get out by only spooking the bare minimum of does in a direction away from where I think the bucks I am after are. Sometimes I just sit tight until that magical day when those first old does start to smell right but are not quite in heat yet. This typically happens the same time every year at a particular spot. The young bucks will be chasing but the big boys will be nearby in the background, typically downwind, waiting.
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Re: Bed hunting in high deer density areas

Unread postby gogebicbuckslayer » Tue Mar 12, 2013 2:16 pm

I have witnessed this as well, the area where I am talking about is a residential area with a lot of people and dogs. I thought that had something to do with it ?

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Re: Bed hunting in high deer density areas

Unread postby phade » Tue Mar 12, 2013 11:59 pm

dan wrote:Phade,
I often have stands back 100 or more yards, in hill country when does bed above the bucks I am often 200 yards back... I certainly don't want to be that far back, but sometimes you have no choice. The good news is they move a little earlier when there are a lot of deer, if the pressure is kept light. But still, sometimes its better to wait for the right day, or right conditions to make a move.

Another thing I have done successfully if there are only a couple beds in bad locations is to block those beds which cause you trouble getting close so they don't get used no more.


Yeah, we're in the same line of thinking, although we're in flat land for the most part. I am actually surprised at the amount this buck appears to move in daylight hours - and I really think it has to do with the does, fawns, and small bucks. There's plenty of food, but I think they give him the sense of security once they move undisturbed.

Based on your threads about "staging areas" in terms of the buck feeling safe, he's moving pretty far before hanging up/milling about before breaking into a protected ag field (meaning no road view, good wind protection). I'd say he's travelling about about twice the distance you normally quote in those situations. Have you seen bucks do that in high DPSM areas with good food/cover? I understand the premise a buck like this would move earlier, but how about going further from the bed? He was a pretty aggressive rubber imo and you can see where he "hangs up" and spent a bunch of time signpost rubbing. I found his sheds about 15 yards into the ag field...maybe 40-50 yards as the crow flies to where his major signposting area is, well into a marshy/brushy cover.
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Re: Bed hunting in high deer density areas

Unread postby bbrilmyer » Wed Mar 13, 2013 12:27 am

Yea I feel that this is extremely common in urban areas we very extreme habitat fragmentation.

In many of the areas that I hunt, where some hunting is still allowed (or not allowed and people don't care regardless), hunters still shy away from hunting too close to residential houses. Whether it be from fear of getting caught or just drawing unwanted attention to themselves from the homeowners. This seems to cause to deer to literally stack up in these small areas of thick cover within 50yrds of pretty consistent human traffic. Bucks and does alike as this is simply the safest and most secure area to bed in. I have found these deer to move very little with a typical movement pattern that consist of bed to backyards..which doesn't leave many opportunities for a shot.

My plan for this year is to set up even closer to these areas and earlier in the AM then last year. Possibly sitting all day if need be.
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Re: Bed hunting in high deer density areas

Unread postby dan » Wed Mar 13, 2013 1:11 am

phade wrote:
dan wrote:Phade,
I often have stands back 100 or more yards, in hill country when does bed above the bucks I am often 200 yards back... I certainly don't want to be that far back, but sometimes you have no choice. The good news is they move a little earlier when there are a lot of deer, if the pressure is kept light. But still, sometimes its better to wait for the right day, or right conditions to make a move.

Another thing I have done successfully if there are only a couple beds in bad locations is to block those beds which cause you trouble getting close so they don't get used no more.


Yeah, we're in the same line of thinking, although we're in flat land for the most part. I am actually surprised at the amount this buck appears to move in daylight hours - and I really think it has to do with the does, fawns, and small bucks. There's plenty of food, but I think they give him the sense of security once they move undisturbed.

Based on your threads about "staging areas" in terms of the buck feeling safe, he's moving pretty far before hanging up/milling about before breaking into a protected ag field (meaning no road view, good wind protection). I'd say he's travelling about about twice the distance you normally quote in those situations. Have you seen bucks do that in high DPSM areas with good food/cover? I understand the premise a buck like this would move earlier, but how about going further from the bed? He was a pretty aggressive rubber imo and you can see where he "hangs up" and spent a bunch of time signpost rubbing. I found his sheds about 15 yards into the ag field...maybe 40-50 yards as the crow flies to where his major signposting area is, well into a marshy/brushy cover.

Yea... They move earlier and further... A lot of my quotes your referring to are from high pressure public.
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Re: Bed hunting in high deer density areas

Unread postby headgear » Wed Mar 13, 2013 4:04 am

You can find a little of this on public land as well, not so much high deer density but a lot of the best bedding areas hold most of the deer in a given area. Add pressure to that and the numbers can go up even more. I've navigated these areas, bumped deer and seen shooter bucks but a lot of the time I bump deer and see nothing. You never can tell when you blew your shot on the way in or not so its a lot of trial and error diving into a place like this.
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Re: Bed hunting in high deer density areas

Unread postby dan » Wed Mar 13, 2013 9:53 am

Even when deer density is not high there are some bedding areas that are hard to encroach... Im not saying you need to always be within a certain distance of a bed... The key is to know where the bucks bed, and use that as part of the puzzle.

On the small private farm I hunt there is a square section of about 10 acres I really can't enter cause of the layout of the bedding. I put food plots in strategic places, and find ways to hunt the edge.
Its really tough to get a mature buck to come out of it in daylight, but the less pressure, the higher my chances.
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Re: Bed hunting in high deer density areas

Unread postby Craaaig » Wed Mar 20, 2013 2:15 pm

Be interesting to know when the bucks are bedding with the does, doesn't sound like a bad idea for the rut. No easier way to scent check the does than to bed behind/down wind of them. This would also eliminate having to wait until about 10 am to go scent check the doe bedding. Ridge runner, is there no other good spots close based on terrain for a buck to bed? What state/terrain? If I was trying to stay alive I wouldn't bed with the does unless it was about time for the rut to kick in or there was no other sufficient/safe bedding.

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Re: Bed hunting in high deer density areas

Unread postby BigHills BuckHunter » Wed Mar 20, 2013 3:55 pm

Quote from DAN:

[glow=red]"I think the situation your referencing is why on private managed lands like a lot of our TV hosts hunt you can shoot the middle aged 3 y/o on food plots pretty easy..."[/glow]

I see this a lot on the land I can hunt. Its about 300 acres private. I have always wondered why they seem to come out a little earlier especially coming out into food plots. The 3 year and under age class seem to fit this description well. Sometimes we get 4.5 yr olds coming into the plots early too but its rare.

However the foodplots we set up are designed for this. We put them in areas further away from the main foodsource with bedding and water surrounding the foodplot.
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Re: Bed hunting in high deer density areas

Unread postby kenn1320 » Wed Mar 20, 2013 9:00 pm

Ridge, your description sounds like southern mi, not sure where your finding more deer psm then there? Some areas had 50-100 deer psm, but ehd has fixed some of those areas. :twisted: I dont think its uncommon in areas with high density and limited cover to find bucks hidden behind does. They can listen for danger that the does find. If the does move out and all is OK, the buck knows he can follow their lead.
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Re: Bed hunting in high deer density areas

Unread postby Craaaig » Wed Mar 20, 2013 10:23 pm

Any evidence of the possible size of the bucks bedding with the does? I found a 3 buck beds in an area that I would expect to find doe beds, but it was pretty obvious the buck beds were more than likely from a 1 yr old buck. The beds had small and short rubs, bad line of sight, very prone to deer drives, easy access from the road...they were buck beds but seemed to be made by immature and less knowledgable bucks!

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