The Results are in!
- forgehunter
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The Results are in!
Dr Kroll has turned in he preliminary report and it is not good news for our DNR.
Here is just one of his comments in the report....
"For the most part in their history of using SAK, WDNR has failed to approach
population goals for the deer herd in DMUs. This includes the CWD Zone
(discussed later). Another approach obviously is warranted."
Link to the report
http://www.dnr.state.wi.us/topic/WildlifeHabitat/documents/krollreport.pdf
Thoughts??
Here is just one of his comments in the report....
"For the most part in their history of using SAK, WDNR has failed to approach
population goals for the deer herd in DMUs. This includes the CWD Zone
(discussed later). Another approach obviously is warranted."
Link to the report
http://www.dnr.state.wi.us/topic/WildlifeHabitat/documents/krollreport.pdf
Thoughts??
Cancer can take away all of my physical abilities. It cannot touch my mind, it cannot touch my heart, and it cannot touch my soul.
Don't give up. Don't ever give up.
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Re: The Results are in!
Hope maybe they will take some of what Dr. Kroll said and and put it to good use!!
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Re: The Results are in!
After reading some of the comments from various media outlets today about the preliminary report, its clear they fail to understand is the term “Problem statement” as it applies to the work of the deer trustee. See the link for a complete understanding of a problem statement
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Problem_statement
but here is the short version.
“A problem statement is a concise description of the issues that need to be addressed by a problem solving team and should be presented to them (or created by them) before they try to solve the problem. When bringing together a team to achieve a particular purpose provide them with a problem statement.”
The title of the Deer Trustee’s preliminary report says:
“INTERIM REPORT OF FINDINGS”
Dr. Kroll and his team went to great lengths to explain where they are in the process and how they got there and what they have learned in order to arrive at a problem statement. In his report he makes several observations and summaries. They can be found on pages 16 thru 21. He then explained the next steps yet some want to pretend this was all we paid for and this is all we got for the money. They are either ignorant or purposefully trying to sour the public to the deer trustees work.
I think people are smarter than they are being given credit for being by some in the media.
I doubt hunters will find much in the way of surprises in the report by Dr. Kroll and his team but that is to be expected because it’s what we hunters have been saying for years. Dr. Kroll and his team came to WI and met with reps from the state’s orgs and with hunters and then created a web site seeking input from hunters. He and his team also dug deeply into WI deer management plan via requests made of DNR reports and data. Dr. Kroll and his team have now formulated and issued a report of findings that is exactly what hunters in WI have been saying for years.
So what’s the difference between what Dr. Kroll and his team are saying and what we hunters have been saying? The difference is that in the past, the DNR and its willing accomplices in the outdoor media downplayed, dismissed and insulted the hunting community and labeled them complainers and “Barstool biologist” because they dared express their concerns for the direction WI deer management has been headed and because hunters objected to management prescriptions we dared to disagree with (as if we had no place objecting despite the fact that we are one half of Wisconsin’s whitetail deer management team responsible for not only carrying out the mission but paying for it.)
Now we have a preliminary report of findings generated by several Pedigreed biologists with the letters PhD, MS, BS, AAS, and titles such as Wildlife biologist, Chief scientist, Professor, teacher and researcher in the fields of Forestry, wildlife population dynamics, Wildlife biology, human dimensions of deer management who have produced many books, dissertations and peer reviewed papers all focusing on wildlife and deer management that represents a combined 100 years of experience directly related to the subject and this team has now produced a preliminary report that mirrors that of Wisconsin’s “barstool biologists”.
Wisconsin’s barstool biologists have been making these same observations publicly and on this and other web sites and in print and in testimony for many years so it is refreshing and a validation of Wisconsin’s many barstool biologists to know that their combined efforts and their concerns have finally been heard and corroborated by a team of honest to goodness biologists.
So, well done fellow barstool biologists. You are in good company now that there is a team working to address the problems you have been so vocal about for so long even if you saw little if any actions addressing your concerns from the state. It looks like the tide is turning. But be warned, The same willing accomplices that labeled you as barstool biologists, will downplay this as “No big deal” and nothing new and a waste of money, insisting that this was all well known already (essentially admitting that we hunters were actually right all along) or that this team was hand selected by insiders and is scripted. Just make sure to continue to do what you have been doing all along by ignoring those irrelevant folks that would still insist you ought to instead listen to the state’s biologists and the out of date management plans and that they know better than you and to just keep shooting.
Lastly and certainly not to be overlooked is a thank you to Governor Walker for listening to hunters and for having the vision to see the direction deer hunting in WI was headed if we maintained the present course. This may be the beginning of the end of the adversarial relationship between the two halves of Wisconsin’s deer management team that is the states deer managers and the private game managers that are deer hunters.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Problem_statement
but here is the short version.
“A problem statement is a concise description of the issues that need to be addressed by a problem solving team and should be presented to them (or created by them) before they try to solve the problem. When bringing together a team to achieve a particular purpose provide them with a problem statement.”
The title of the Deer Trustee’s preliminary report says:
“INTERIM REPORT OF FINDINGS”
Dr. Kroll and his team went to great lengths to explain where they are in the process and how they got there and what they have learned in order to arrive at a problem statement. In his report he makes several observations and summaries. They can be found on pages 16 thru 21. He then explained the next steps yet some want to pretend this was all we paid for and this is all we got for the money. They are either ignorant or purposefully trying to sour the public to the deer trustees work.
I think people are smarter than they are being given credit for being by some in the media.
I doubt hunters will find much in the way of surprises in the report by Dr. Kroll and his team but that is to be expected because it’s what we hunters have been saying for years. Dr. Kroll and his team came to WI and met with reps from the state’s orgs and with hunters and then created a web site seeking input from hunters. He and his team also dug deeply into WI deer management plan via requests made of DNR reports and data. Dr. Kroll and his team have now formulated and issued a report of findings that is exactly what hunters in WI have been saying for years.
So what’s the difference between what Dr. Kroll and his team are saying and what we hunters have been saying? The difference is that in the past, the DNR and its willing accomplices in the outdoor media downplayed, dismissed and insulted the hunting community and labeled them complainers and “Barstool biologist” because they dared express their concerns for the direction WI deer management has been headed and because hunters objected to management prescriptions we dared to disagree with (as if we had no place objecting despite the fact that we are one half of Wisconsin’s whitetail deer management team responsible for not only carrying out the mission but paying for it.)
Now we have a preliminary report of findings generated by several Pedigreed biologists with the letters PhD, MS, BS, AAS, and titles such as Wildlife biologist, Chief scientist, Professor, teacher and researcher in the fields of Forestry, wildlife population dynamics, Wildlife biology, human dimensions of deer management who have produced many books, dissertations and peer reviewed papers all focusing on wildlife and deer management that represents a combined 100 years of experience directly related to the subject and this team has now produced a preliminary report that mirrors that of Wisconsin’s “barstool biologists”.
Wisconsin’s barstool biologists have been making these same observations publicly and on this and other web sites and in print and in testimony for many years so it is refreshing and a validation of Wisconsin’s many barstool biologists to know that their combined efforts and their concerns have finally been heard and corroborated by a team of honest to goodness biologists.
So, well done fellow barstool biologists. You are in good company now that there is a team working to address the problems you have been so vocal about for so long even if you saw little if any actions addressing your concerns from the state. It looks like the tide is turning. But be warned, The same willing accomplices that labeled you as barstool biologists, will downplay this as “No big deal” and nothing new and a waste of money, insisting that this was all well known already (essentially admitting that we hunters were actually right all along) or that this team was hand selected by insiders and is scripted. Just make sure to continue to do what you have been doing all along by ignoring those irrelevant folks that would still insist you ought to instead listen to the state’s biologists and the out of date management plans and that they know better than you and to just keep shooting.
Lastly and certainly not to be overlooked is a thank you to Governor Walker for listening to hunters and for having the vision to see the direction deer hunting in WI was headed if we maintained the present course. This may be the beginning of the end of the adversarial relationship between the two halves of Wisconsin’s deer management team that is the states deer managers and the private game managers that are deer hunters.
- PLB
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Re: The Results are in!
It's a step in the right direction I suppose.I'm cautiously optimistic. Fingers crossed.
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Re: The Results are in!
Some of the suggestions are a tough pill to swallow, but I agree with many, its time for a change!
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Re: The Results are in!
Great post Ron!
Do you have a link to this website?
Dr. Kroll and his team came to WI and met with reps from the state’s orgs and with hunters and then created a web site seeking input from hunters.
Do you have a link to this website?
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Re: The Results are in!
Thanks for the link.
I must say, after viewing the video, Dr Kroll has a well thought out strategy for analyzing Wisconsins deer management situation.
I must say, after viewing the video, Dr Kroll has a well thought out strategy for analyzing Wisconsins deer management situation.
- forgehunter
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Re: The Results are in!
I like the fact that the Town Hall meeting will be able to be viewed live over the net as well as the ability to participate too.
sounds like they may be able to bring some new and benificial ideas to the table that wil improve the management here. We need to get the word out to every hunter we know!
sounds like they may be able to bring some new and benificial ideas to the table that wil improve the management here. We need to get the word out to every hunter we know!
Cancer can take away all of my physical abilities. It cannot touch my mind, it cannot touch my heart, and it cannot touch my soul.
Don't give up. Don't ever give up.
Jimmy V.
Don't give up. Don't ever give up.
Jimmy V.
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Re: The Results are in!
So far so good... now comes the hard part. Implementing a plan that meets the change goals
"When a hunter is in a tree stand with high moral values, with the proper hunting ethics and richer for the experience, that hunter is 20 feet closer to God." Fred Bear
- Uncle Lou
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Re: The Results are in!
Great post Rancid. I thought you guys were spoiled before. Looks like things can even get better for WI.
- jlh42581
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Re: The Results are in!
I really dont think you guys are reading some of this the right way. The way I read it, youre headed for exactly what PA is cooking and you guys better fight tooth and nail. What hes saying is that due to SAK and goals not being me is that you are not going to get MORE deer. If you read further down he goes on to say that the carrying capacity over winter has been too high. This means youre going to see more doe's go down, not less.
- lungbuster
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Re: The Results are in!
jlh42581 wrote:I really dont think you guys are reading some of this the right way. The way I read it, youre headed for exactly what PA is cooking and you guys better fight tooth and nail. What hes saying is that due to SAK and goals not being me is that you are not going to get MORE deer. If you read further down he goes on to say that the carrying capacity over winter has been too high. This means youre going to see more doe's go down, not less.
You may be right, I have also spoken with a number of hunters from PA over the years since Gary Alt was thier biologist and none had anything good to say about what he did to PA's deer herd. (Gary Alt is one of the biologist Dr. Kroll mentioned is "helping" with this situation)
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