Question about putting minerals out in WI

[cornfedkiller]

Ok I just recently found out that its illegal to put minerals out in Wisconsin unless its during open season. Well that obviously doesnt work very well since minerals dont really get hit real hard during season (not like they do in the summer anyways), and the majority of the reason I put minerals out is for taking inventory in the summer (and help the deer out with some salt I suppose).

Anyways, I know what the law states, and theres not much I can do about it, but what are your thoughts about this..

I typically put my salt out in loose form (water softener crystals) and mix them into the dirt. If I put the salt out NOW (dumping the crystals out on the ground and working it into the soil), since the season is open and its legal to place it there (2 gallons), what happens once the season is over? Am I going to get in trouble for salt that I put there earlier in the year when it was legal to put there?? (Its not like I can help that the deer are hitting that spot all summer right?)

If its a block or something easy to take away, I can see how the DNR could tell me to pull it or write me a ticket for leaving it out, but crystals mixed into the dirt...???

What are your thoughts??

[Rutnstrut]

Technically if they went by the letter of the law, yes they could write a ticket if there was mineral left during the closed season. I have been over this with the DNR and a few different wardens. The one legal way to feed or have mineral out year round is to have it within 50 yds of an inhabited dwelling. Stupid laws, but hey our DNR is great at dreaming up stupid .

[BowtechHunting]

Ok I just recently found out that its illegal to put minerals out in Wisconsin unless its during open season. Well that obviously doesnt work very well since minerals dont really get hit real hard during season (not like they do in the summer anyways), and the majority of the reason I put minerals out is for taking inventory in the summer (and help the deer out with some salt I suppose).

Anyways, I know what the law states, and theres not much I can do about it, but what are your thoughts about this..

I typically put my salt out in loose form (water softener crystals) and mix them into the dirt. If I put the salt out NOW (dumping the crystals out on the ground and working it into the soil), since the season is open and its legal to place it there (2 gallons), what happens once the season is over? Am I going to get in trouble for salt that I put there earlier in the year when it was legal to put there?? (Its not like I can help that the deer are hitting that spot all summer right?)

If its a block or something easy to take away, I can see how the DNR could tell me to pull it or write me a ticket for leaving it out, but crystals mixed into the dirt...???

What are your thoughts??

Funny, I was about to post a similar topic. I bought a few bags of Deer Cane (on sale!) and a block for next year. I can't afford a food plot and don't have much land to work with (12 acres with 2 funnels), but I did have 200+ pics of some does and few small bucks and a nice 8. As soon as the season is over, I'm going to place these items around. My question is, have you had any luck with them? Meaning, a increase number of deer coming to your area. I haven't been a fan of
"attractants" whatever that may entail, but I figured I could give it shot with the limited amount of land that I have. It's kinda my QDM program I'm trying to start. I gotta get rid of some does first!

[cornfedkiller]

Technically if they went by the letter of the law, yes they could write a ticket if there was mineral left during the closed season. I have been over this with the DNR and a few different wardens. The one legal way to feed or have mineral out year round is to have it within 50 yds of an inhabited dwelling. Stupid laws, but hey our DNR is great at dreaming up stupid CENSORED FOR BAD LANGUAGE.

But if the salt is dissolved into the soil, how am I supposed to remove it?

Funny, I was about to post a similar topic. I bought a few bags of Deer Cane (on sale!) and a block for next year. I can't afford a food plot and don't have much land to work with (12 acres with 2 funnels), but I did have 200+ pics of some does and few small bucks and a nice 8. As soon as the season is over, I'm going to place these items around. My question is, have you had any luck with them? Meaning, a increase number of deer coming to your area. I haven't been a fan of
"attractants" whatever that may entail, but I figured I could give it shot with the limited amount of land that I have. It's kinda my QDM program I'm trying to start. I gotta get rid of some does first!

Heres my thoughts and experiences..take it or leave it..

Deer Cane, IMO, is a waste of money..the VAST majority of it is salt, and it is far cheaper to buy water softener salt..its like $4-5 for a 40lb bag. Also, I have had MUCH better luck with loose salt mixed in with the soil than I have had with blocks. I think the deer prefer pawing and licking the soil like they naturally would vs licking a solid block. Also, unless you break your block into pieces, one block can only do one spot (which isnt a big deal if you only have 12 acres like you mentioned), whereas a 40lb bag of salt does multiple sites.

I used to make a concoction of dicalcium phosphate, trace minerals, salt, etc but have since switched to just plain salt and havent noticed a bit of difference..Except I have way more money in my wallet now.

[BowtechHunting]

Water softener salt? Not a bad idea, same thing as Cane. I agree, it's way easier to make your own and get more than to buy pre-made stuff. But, like I said I got Deer Cane on sale for 3.50 a bag. Never would I pay full price. I never used it, like I said, but I'll give it shot. I'll keep that in mind and the advice.

I have deer using the my area, but they don't stick around. It's mainly just a passing through corridor or just a short-cut for the most part. I just don't see a lot of resident deer. I think the minerals would help come summer to keep them around in the area if I keep it going. I plan on getting a bag of clover and maybe that would help.

[dan]

I really don't think minerals are doing much to help you keep deer on your land. Yes, they go to them and use them, but there in your woods because of different reasons... With that said, there are only two good reasons for useing minerals, #1 to put a camera over and take inventory. #2 To add inches to growing antlers.
So with number two you are not doing a whole lot for the deer just useing salt. Picking a mineral suppliment that has the needed ingrediants to help antler growth would do muvh more... And if your not putting it out in the summer / spring, it aint really helping either.

[cornfedkiller]

I really don't think minerals are doing much to help you keep deer on your land. Yes, they go to them and use them, but there in your woods because of different reasons... With that said, there are only two good reasons for useing minerals, #1 to put a camera over and take inventory. #2 To add inches to growing antlers.
So with number two you are not doing a whole lot for the deer just useing salt. Picking a mineral suppliment that has the needed ingrediants to help antler growth would do muvh more... And if your not putting it out in the summer / spring, it aint really helping either.

I agree that minerals are not going to hold deer on your land. I dont believe they are seeking minerals out like they are seeking food or cover, and they pretty much stop (more or less) using them come hunting season anyways, so its not like you are going to be attracting a ton of traffic to them during the season.

The reason #1 that Dan stated is the main reason I use them. I also like to have everything I can available to deer that they would want on a property, so if I can put minerals out, Im going to put some out.

I am going to have to admit that I do not agree with #2 above though. I have read many college studies that have studied the effects of supplemental minerals, and I have yet to find one that shows any evidence of increased antler size. Every study Ive read to date has shown absolutely no difference between supplemented and non-supplemented deer in terms of antler size. Like I mentioned above, I used to make a whole concoction of minerals to help the deer grow larger antlers, but since I have not found a single thing that says its helping to grow bigger racks (other than on the package), so I switched back to regular salt..

[dan]

I am going to have to admit that I do not agree with #2 above though. I have read many college studies that have studied the effects of supplemental minerals, and I have yet to find one that shows any evidence of increased antler size. Every study Ive read to date has shown absolutely no difference between supplemented and non-supplemented deer in terms of antler size. Like I mentioned above, I used to make a whole concoction of minerals to help the deer grow larger antlers, but since I have not found a single thing that says its helping to grow bigger racks (other than on the package), so I switched back to regular salt..

I have to question that... In a wild situation, I wonder myself how much it helps, but I do think large calcium intakes are going to go into the antlers after bone needs. The same reason I believe older bucks grow larger racks, there bodys don't need the calcium as much for bone growth...
I do know, that on the ranchs ( fenced ) minerals are a big part of growing the 400 inch bucks we all see all over the magazines and forums... I think in a wild situation, where certain minerals are lacking in the enviroment, getting those minerals to the deer has to help... How much? I don't know. I know Andrae believes he is putting more deer over 170 on his ground by supplimenting minerals to....
My biggest issue with minerals is I think most of them get the needed minerals to the deer by the use of large quanitys of salt, which I think is bad for the deer.

[Rutnstrut]

I really don't think minerals are doing much to help you keep deer on your land. Yes, they go to them and use them, but there in your woods because of different reasons... With that said, there are only two good reasons for useing minerals, #1 to put a camera over and take inventory. #2 To add inches to growing antlers.
So with number two you are not doing a whole lot for the deer just useing salt. Picking a mineral suppliment that has the needed ingrediants to help antler growth would do muvh more... And if your not putting it out in the summer / spring, it aint really helping either.

You forgot Dan that minerals are also very beneficial to lactating does and their fawns. Give that buck fawn the minerals he needs in his first spring/summer and it's a great building block for body and antler health in years to come.

[dan]

Good point Rutnstrut

[BCam]

I really don't think minerals are doing much to help you keep deer on your land. Yes, they go to them and use them, but there in your woods because of different reasons... With that said, there are only two good reasons for useing minerals, #1 to put a camera over and take inventory. #2 To add inches to growing antlers.
So with number two you are not doing a whole lot for the deer just useing salt. Picking a mineral suppliment that has the needed ingrediants to help antler growth would do muvh more... And if your not putting it out in the summer / spring, it aint really helping either.

You forgot Dan that minerals are also very beneficial to lactating does and their fawns. Give that buck fawn the minerals he needs in his first spring/summer and it's a great building block for body and antler health in years to come.

Man i have to agree with you guys... This sounds a lot like what any educated farmer or vet would tell you just from knowing both. Unless deer are different?

[BackWoodsHunter]

This turned from a question on the legal aspect about timing of placing minerals to a discussion about the benefits of them. Since the thread is off track I want to contribute this article I read on the QDMA website. There are various studies referenced here but both showed that the final result was that deer supplemented with minerals were not noticeably larger or healthier than deer that went without mineral supplements. The theory of needing minerals makes sense from every aspect but science seems to say differently. A few things noted were that they may be more beneficial in areas where there is mineral deficiency. There is a great correlation between antler and body size in deer in areas with more phosphorus rich soils. Likely because the phosphorus contributes to better crop/plant growth not directly to the deers antlers. The emphasis on nutrition appears to be more important than providing supplements. Also, cornfed isn't too far off on providing salt. It says that during the summer months the deer are at a sodium deficiency because of high potassium and water content in their diet. Basically all the lush green vegetation they are eating causes them to NEED salt. They also tend to prefer the salt over the pure mineral blocks because the more pure forms of minerals are bitter. Here is the article kind of a long read.

Also for the people using deer cane have you ever tasted that stuff? Not sure what it says on the bag but its like those pixie sticks. I had an empty bag of it one time and I crushed the bag and the powder rushed out and into my mouth/nose it was very sweet. Which may be part of why the deer like it?

Whitetail Science – Minerals
QDMA Articles

By Brian Murphy


With spring just around the corner, hunters everywhere are gearing up to begin establishing or “recharging” the mineral sites on their hunting properties. They know that deer typically begin using supplemental minerals around spring green-up and continue until early fall. Surely, the knee-deep depressions in the soil caused by repeated years of mineral supplementation are evidence of deer need and, thus, benefit. But, is there any scientific evidence to support this?


Before discussing the research on mineral supplementation, let’s review the basics of antler growth. During spring, the onset of antler growth is triggered by changes in photoperiod (day length). What follows is a complicated process of hormone release and changes in the deer’s body to enable the rapid transfer of nutrients to the growing antlers. This process continues until late summer when a sharp increase in the male hormone, testosterone, stimulates antler hardening and velvet shedding.


Growing antlers are composed mostly of proteins (80 percent by weight); whereas hardened antlers contain roughly equal amounts of proteins and minerals. Studies have shown that calcium and phosphorus are by far the two most common minerals in deer antlers, comprising 30–35 percent of the mature antler by weight. However, a University of Georgia study detected 11 different minerals in the whitetail’s antlers. In addition to calcium (19 percent) and phosphorus (10 percent), the next most common elements were magnesium (1 percent) and sodium (0.5 percent). Lesser amounts of other minerals were found including potassium, barium, iron, aluminum, zinc, strontium and manganese. Besides calcium and phosphorus, little is known about the role of other minerals in antler growth.

Clearly minerals are important in antler development. Because of the large quantities of minerals required for antler growth, whitetails have developed the ability to “bank” calcium and phosphorus in their skeletons and then transfer these minerals during antler growth. However, these body sources of calcium and phosphorus provide only a portion needed for optimum antler growth. The rest must come directly from their diet while their antlers are actively growing. Therefore, mineral supplementation prior to and during antler growth may be beneficial.

Research on domestic livestock has documented numerous benefits of mineral supplementation including increased forage intake, improved forage digestion, and increased reproductive success. In contrast, most studies on whitetails have focused on the impacts on body weight and antler development. Researchers at Mississippi State University found a strong correlation between soil mineral content (primarily phosphorus) and body size, although no correlation with adult antler size was found. They concluded that soil phosphorus levels were the best indicator of body size, probably because phosphorus deficient soils are common throughout the United States.

A classic study on the mineral needs of deer was conducted at Penn State University in the 1950s. In this study, researchers did detect a difference in yearling buck antler development between supplemented and unsupplemented groups. However, these herds were fed a nutritionally deficient diet below what most whitetails would have access to in the wild. Furthermore, when the same deer were examined the following year as 2.5–year–olds, no differences were detected between the two groups.

In a similar study conducted at Auburn University, researchers tried to detect differences in body and antler size between an unsupplemented and supplemented group. This study differed from the Penn State study in that both herds were fed a nutritionally complete diet. In addition, one group was provided a commercial mineral supplement. Over a four year period the researchers were unable to detect any differences between the two deer herds.

Without question deer need minerals, and they will readily use mineral licks. But why do they use these licks and why is their use restricted primarily to the spring and summer? Many hunters believe that it is simply because bucks need the minerals for antler growth and does for raising fawns during these months. However, several studies have shown that while deer readily use mineral licks high in salt, they rarely, if ever, use pure mineral supplements. If deer were lacking minerals, why wouldn’t they use the pure mineral supplement even if salt wasn’t present? No one can say for sure, but it’s probably because most minerals by themselves are bitter.

Could the use of salt/mineral mixes simply be due to an increased need for salt? According to research, yes. During the spring and summer, deer operate at a sodium deficiency due to the high potassium and water content of the forage. This interferes with efficient sodium conversion in the body and increases the need for sodium. This makes deer actively seek out concentrated sources of sodium such as natural or man–made licks. Almost all soils more than 25–50 miles from a seacoast are low in sodium. Therefore, in these areas, salt may be just as necessary as calcium and phosphorus to whitetails during the spring and summer.

What does all this mean to the average deer hunter and manager? The results of these studies suggest that mineral supplementation – especially calcium, phosphorus, and sodium – may provide some benefit, especially in situations where deer are nutritionally deprived or areas with minerally deficient soils. However, age and nutrition are the two most important ingredients for producing large antlered bucks. Regardless of the intensity of mineral supplementation, a yearling buck will still be a yearling buck. Bucks must live long enough to reach physical maturity while having access to high quality nutrition to achieve maximum antler growth. Creating a lick is certainly fun, inexpensive, and watching deer respond to these licks is satisfying. Mineral licks also provide a great place to survey deer with game cameras.

So, if you have already addressed the larger concerns of habitat and herd management, mineral supplements can be another part of your overall management plan. The key is to have realistic expectations. Don’t expect to see trophy bucks walking around this fall just because you gave them a mineral boost this spring. While the advantages of mineral supplementation have not been clearly documented, neither have any disadvantages.

Brian Murphy is a Certified Wildlife Biologist and CEO of the Quality Deer Management Association. This column originally appeared in Bowhunting World magazine. Visit www.QDMA.com and www.bowhuntingworld.com for more information.

This article was taken directly from a previous issue of Quality Whitetails, the bi-monthly journal of the QDMA. The $30 annual membership to QDMA includes a subscription to this acclaimed publication. For information on joining QDMA, click here.

For more information on Whitetail Science:

Whitetail Science – Rut
Whitetail Science – Sheds

[cornfedkiller]

.....Also, cornfed isn't too far off on providing salt. It says that during the summer months the deer are at a sodium deficiency because of high potassium and water content in their diet. Basically all the lush green vegetation they are eating causes them to NEED salt. They also tend to prefer the salt over the pure mineral blocks because the more pure forms of minerals are bitter.

Exactly what Ive been told as well..

There is no doubt they need minerals, just like humans, but I believe they get more than enough minerals from their normal diets and in their normal environment (in the midwest and other areas with nutrient rich soil), and supplementing them doesnt do much for them when they are already getting enough. Take humans for instance..No doubt that Vitamin C is good for us, helps with immune function, keeps us from getting scurvy, etc, etc, BUT, the vast majority of people that eat a balanced diet do not need supplemented vitamin c since we get enough of it in out diet. Anything we take in above and beyond what our body can use just gets excreted..

[goldtip5575]

Technically if they went by the letter of the law, yes they could write a ticket if there was mineral left during the closed season. I have been over this with the DNR and a few different wardens. The one legal way to feed or have mineral out year round is to have it within 50 yds of an inhabited dwelling. Stupid laws, but hey our DNR is great at dreaming up stupid CENSORED FOR BAD LANGUAGE.

If you read the regs it still states that if 50 yards of a dwelling it needs to be placed where deer cant access the bait.Needs to be enclosed and at a height they cant access.You would probably lose that battle with the DNR.